[Aztlan] A question about Aztecs and armadillos
micc
micc at cox.net
Mon Oct 6 19:43:45 UTC 2014
I do not have the exact sources on hand. But I have read several
articles in journals that the Spanish crown was worried that the
recently arrived Spanish instrument makers where losing business to the
indigenous instrument makers. As you say, the Franciscans taught the
indigenous people, especially in Michoacan (where Paracho to this day
is famous for its instruments) to make vihuelas, mandolinas, mandolones,
violas, violins, and even organs for church services. I recall reading
that by the 159o0's however, the colonial authorities were making it
difficult for the indigenous luthiers to practice their arts in the
Spanish colonial cities. They did however continue to work in the small
towns and villages where the Danza Chichimeca evolved.
> Mas aun en el siglo XVI no había guitarras creo que ni en España. Fue
> el siglo de la vihuela...
Esto es cierto, y la guitarra conchera es efectivamente una copia de la
laúd del siglo 16.
> Y de hecho en el siglo XVI y buena parte del XVII los otomies fueron
> conquistadores, fueron parte del bando ganador no fueron de los
> perdedores
Esto también es cierto. Y por eso la Danza "chichimeca/Conchera/Azteca"
se fue expandiendo al centro sur, y hasta el norte de mesoamerica.
Pero la historia de la danza no termina en estos siglos, Los
contratiempos siguen viniendo en los siglos XVII hasta la revolución de
1910.
--
I live for reasoned, enlightened spirituality:
"Tlacecelilli", tranquilidad, paz
Mario E. Aguilar, PhD
619.948.8861
www.mexicayotl.net
www.mexicayotl.org
www.mexicayotl.com
www.aguila-blanca.com
On 10/5/2014 12:04 AM, Roberto Romero wrote:
> Mario
>
> No tengo noticia alguna de que los españoles hayan prohibido a los
> indios otomies y a los demás indígenas el tener guitarras y mandolinas
> de madera.
>
> Mas aun hay datos iconográficos y textuales que inidican que los
> indios los usaban , y los fabricaban. De hecho la enseñanza de oficios
> y de construcción de intrumentos musicales de tipo europeo fue uno de
> los medidas que acompañaron a la evangelización católica...
>
> De que fuente histórica , libro, ensayo obtuviste esa información de
> la prohibición de usar instrumentos musicales que me parece
> absolutamante falsa y ajena a la verdad histórica.
>
> Mas aun en el siglo XVI no había guitarras creo que ni en España. Fue
> el siglo de la vihuela...
>
> Y de hecho en el siglo XVI y buena parte del XVII los otomies fueron
> conquistadores, fueron parte del bando ganador no fueron de los
> perdedores
>
> Roberto Romero
>
> 2014-10-03 8:59 GMT+06:00, mario <micc2 at cox.net>:
>> It is said in the Danza Chichimeca/Conchera/Azteca that when the Spanish
>> prohibited the Otomi and other indigenous people from getting wood
>> materials to make their guitars and mandolins, they began to use the
>> shells of the Armadillo. Thus we are called "concheros".....
>>
>> Today, certain revisionist new age "Mexi'ca dancers" use the word
>> Conchero as a disparaging term for "Hispanicized Ladino" dancers.
>>
>> But those of us that follow the Indocristiano traditions of La Danza, we
>> dance with our "dillos" with pride!!!!!
>>
>> On another note, when My son found out that armadillos can carry
>> Leprosy, he went around spraying all our Conchas with Lysol!!!
>>
>> --
>> I live for reasoned, enlightened spirituality:
>>
>> "Tlacecelilli", tranquilidad, paz
>>
>>
>> Mario E. Aguilar, PhD
>>
>> 619.948.8861
>>
>> www.mexicayotl.net
>> www.mexicayotl.org
>> www.mexicayotl.com
>> www.aguila-blanca.com
>>
>> On 10/2/2014 9:02 AM, Peter Keeler wrote:
>>> U'uyeh, Listeros,
>>>
>>> The recent interchange (on Aztlan) about the word for armadillo in
>>> nahuatl,
>>>
>>> eg:
>>>
>>> "It is ayotochtli not azotochtli. Whoever told you azo... Probably was
>>> misinformed.
>>>
>>> Yes, it means something along the lines of turtle rabbit.
>>>
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPad
>>> John Schwaller
>>> Professor of History
>>> University at Albany "
>>>
>>> ......prompted an off-line discussion among some of my Mayanist friends,
>>>
>>> in which I made the point that armadillos can move fast, when they
>>> want to:
>>>
>>> " Also NB armadillo ears, rather rabbit-like.
>>>
>>> and they can really moooove.
>>>
>>> once upon a long long time ago, W. and I out in the [Texas] hill
>>> country, we encountered a dillo, by the road. W. began to walk in her
>>> direction; she started ambling away. W. walked a little faster, she began
>>> to slowly lope away. W. began a slow run, and she took off. Then he ran
>>> full speed, and she was moving about twice as fast. And, like a
>>> jackrabbit, she was gone.
>>>
>>> a delightful animal, long the mascot of the counter-culture. Dillos
>>> are pretty laid back, unless you are running after them. "
>>>
>>> Which elicited the image below from W (still running, or at least
>>> ambling, after all these years), that I suspect most of our Nahuatl
>>> listeros already know:
>>>
>>> "Early (? earliest) illustration of an armadillo (Florentine Codex, Book
>>> 11; page 61, fig. 201)."
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I urge interested parties to visit the web to see more accurate
>>> photographic depictions of this peaceful critter.
>>>
>>>
>>> http://www.google.com/images?client=safari&rls=en&q=armadillo&oe=UTF-8&hl=en&sa=X&oi=image_result_group&ei=QHQtVN38NZT-yQTMjYHIDQ&ved=0CCoQsAQ
>>>
>>> that's all,
>>>
>>> Peter
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Nahuatl mailing list
>>> Nahuatl at lists.famsi.org
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