Interview with Krzysztof Zanussi, by Ukrainian Film Club director

[Diana Howansky]

Below please find the beginning of an interview with Polish film
director Krzysztof Zanussi, who discusses Ukrainian film with the head
of the Ukrainian Film Club at Columbia University, Dr. Yuri Shevchuk. To
read the whole interview, please go to the Ukrainian Film Club's website
at http://www.columbia.edu/cu/ufc/. On this website, under "Forum," you
can also add to posts commenting on this interview, as well as other topics.

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...I began to look critically at history, because we were forced to
accept false views of history, which we attempted to reject. The
Hungarians approached the problem of historical truth in a very
interesting way, in terms of their relations with the Slovaks, in which
I see a real analogue to the relations between Poland and Western
Ukraine. In my view, this was something similar to Silesia, where the
Polish or Slavic element ousted by the Germans. I myself observed
similar processes and compared them with the Spanish conquest of the
Pyrenean peninsula from the Moors.

YS: What specifically interests you in Ukrainian history?

KZ: I have been interested for a long time in the question of why
certain nations have succeeded in history and other haven’t, some were
able to accomplish their goals, and others were not as successful. I
still make unexpected discoveries on this subject. Once I was in the
German city of Achen, which was one of the later capitals of the Holy
Roman Empire. Then I went to Kyiv, and there I understood that it is
entirely possible to compare the two cathedrals located in each city -
the Cathedral of Saint Sofia in Kyiv, and the Charlemagne Cathedral in
Achen. Both were built around approximately the same time. The only
thing is that the St. Sofia Cathedral in Kyiv is incomparably larger and
grander, because Ruthenian civilization of the time was much stronger
compared to the civilization of Charlemagne. This was in the Ukraine
which many in Western Europe today cannot yet find on the map. Such
changes in historical fates, the rise and fall of civilizations, cause
strong emotions in me. I don’t want to be a member of a losing nation.
For that reason I follow closely the fates of those who have lost. For
the most part, Ukrainians have lost in the most direct sense, but now
have gained their historical opportunity. Although not long ago it
appeared that Ukrainians lost irreparably, and suddenly this opportunity
presents itself! Such things are incredibly interesting to me.

My interest in Ukraine also comes from my wife, who is from the line of
Czetwertynski, related by blood to the Szeptycki family. At certain
moment, the Szeptyckis felt themselves to be more Ruthenian than Polish.
This Ruthenian princely dynasty split in two, one part of which
gravitated towards Poland and the other towards Ruthenia.

YS: In what way is the issue of national identity for you connected to film?

KZ: I wanted to find among my Ukrainian colleagues in filmmaking their
national identity. From the first contacts, I tried to draw out of them
some sort of purely Ukrainian traits, but they didn’t understand me. For
them, the capital was Moscow, and Ukraine was little more than a Russian
province. It is this mindset that they made their films. Ironic as it
may be, for me the first person who revealed a strong sense of Ukraine
was an Armenian. This fellow, like me, was very strongly interested in
Ukraine. He spoke Ukrainian very well, even better than my Ukrainian
colleagues.

YS: Are you talking about Paradzhanov?

KZ: No, Paradzhanov is Georgian. For me, the Ukrainianness of
Paradzhanov had something touristy about it. It was the Ukrainianness of
a tourist. Of course he had his own aesthetics, but in my view he did
not demonstrate a very sensitive ear to the local culture.
In September of last year, just before the revolution, before your
elections, I unexpectedly received an award in Ukraine from your vice
premier, who was a historian, and apparently distant from Kuchma. We had
a long conversation. He had read somewhere that every time I met with
Ukrainian filmmakers, I tried to convince them of the need for them to
show their Ukrainian uniqueness, and not their similarity to Poles or
Russians. “Show me how you are different. Who is your hero? How can I
tell that he is not a Pole or a Russian, but specifically a Ukrainian?”,
I would say . . .

(See website http://www.columbia.edu/cu/ufc/ for the rest of the interview.)

--
Diana Howansky
Staff Associate
Ukrainian Studies Program
Columbia University
Room 1209, MC3345
420 W. 118th Street
New York, NY  10027
(212) 854-4697
ukrainianstudies at columbia.edu
http://www.sipa.columbia.edu/ukrainianstudies/

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