AW: [sw-l] SignPuddle and mundbilder

Stefan Wöhrmann stefanwoehrmann at GEBAERDENSCHRIFT.DE
Sat Aug 6 23:49:01 UTC 2005

Hello Suzanne, 

welcome to the SW - list. Nice to have you aboard!!! 

ha would be great to put a face to the name ... so it is worth to have a
document with all the faces of the participants ... 

Thanks for your reply to my "Handbuch der GebärdenSchrift".

You are absolutely right that the book is not restricted to German
Signlanguage - since all the hand shapes and movement symbols and the
general idea of SignWriting should be a support to anybody who is interested
in SignWriting. Especially I put much energy and attention to include the
knowledge of the email lessons of the last few years. 

Regarding the Mundbilder -- 

You are absolutely right. The Mundbilder - are a very important part of SL
in some SL in the world. On the other side it seems to become a question of
"political correctness".

Some people seem to dislike the idea that SL incude these voiceless lip- and
mouth - and tongue movements - 

But coming from an experience with transcribing SL - videos - I looked very
very attentivly. Valerie Sutton taught us : Write what you see -- that is
what Movement Writing is all about. 

Now it is the scribes decision to include only the crucial part of a
Mundbild - pattern or a whole series.

I have to decide each time when I write a document - how much support is
needed for my reader. My students that are still on their way to achieve
spoken language competence take a lot advantage out of signs with lots of
"SpeachWriting" ... 

But your idea -

.... " or is it more economical, do you only show the
mundbilder that are absolutely necesary to understand the

is absolutely correct. I try to concentrate on as few Mundbilder as are
necessary in order to identify or to distinguish similar looking signs. 


-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
Von: owner-sw-l at
[mailto:owner-sw-l at] Im Auftrag von Suzanne Pach
Gesendet: Samstag, 6. August 2005 22:32
An: sw-l at
Betreff: [sw-l] SignPuddle and mundbilder

Hi everybody!

I got some questions about SignPuddle and mundbilder..

Inspired by the Brussels Symposium, I started playing with
the Dutch SignPuddle. I managed to fill the empty puddle
with the numbers 1 till 9, but for some reason I added the
numbers 6 and 9 twice. So, is there a way to remove signs
you did add the the dictionary? (by the way, in signpuddle
it is written 'Netherlands Sign Language'. This sounds
slightly strange to me. Well, I don't mind, but for some
reason the English always seem to call us Dutch... or am I

And another question: I added the signs using Internet
explorer, but yesterday I read that you shouldn't use Int
Expl for signPuddle. Is that still true?

Then a question about the 'mundbildschrift'. Stefan, I'm
reading your book now. My compliments! It's really nice
and clear (and I learnt a lot of new german words too :).
But I got a question about the mundbildschrift. You give a
lot of examples of signs using 'mundbilder'. Sometimes you
show the mundbilder of all the letters of the spoken word,
but in most cases you only show the mundbild of the first
letter or most important vowel of the spoken word. Is that
because it's really articulated like that in German Sign
Language, or is it more economical, do you only show the
mundbilder that are absolutely necesary to understand the
sign?  I ask this, because in Dutch Sign Language those
mundbilder are often really important to distinguish the
different signs.

Thanks for your time and have a nice night (or day..)


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