Ordering Signs in Dictionaries

Thu Aug 14 02:05:50 UTC 2014

Hi Charles,
     I watched your talk again today.  I realized that what I call "Sign 
Sequence" you call "Sign Spelling".  I guess it is "SignSpelling 
Sequence".  So I didn't understand that the first time.  So now after 
this more attentive listening to your talk, I see that you definitely 
are using SignSpelling Sequence for all your entries and that you are 
doing them manually the same way Val suggested in the SignSpelling 
Guidelines.
     Am I correct in my understanding that which symbols come first in 
the sorted list is different from the way SignPuddle is sorting?

Your sorting would be sorted by the
1. First by symbol in the sign sequence's basegroup of the first hand in 
the SignSpelling Sequence
2. What figure (See the individual chapters)? *I need more explanation 
about this one.*
3. The for each basegroup sort by fill

4. In each fill sorting, sort by rotation *( but not distinguishing 
between right and left hands.
I see you number both from 1 to 8 in instead of numbering them all from 
1 to 16)*

5. Location symbol. comes after hand symbol when comparing.
 From first to last
No Body - hand to hand, head, body

5.1 Location sorting on hand *contact order doesn't seem to be defined yet*

5.2 Head location sorting

5.3 Body body
Indicate the location of the body, placing the graphic in the left lane, 
the middle lane, or
right lane. - *Need this explained I'm not understanding.*
*Needs to have numbering for which comes first for body location**
*

6 - What is contact? No order, any can come first.

7.7 - Finger bends (ie no order)?No order, any can come first.

8 - Movement? Vertical, then Horizontal, then Arc - up / down, up / 
abaxo + rotation, then up / down bow
after / below + arc rotation, face bow, face bow + rotation

*Need to define which come first within the vertical, and which come 
first within the horizontal, etc.**  Or just current default currently 
in ISWA2010
**Need to define movement symbols in other planes, etc.
***

9 Timing. *Which comes first?*

10 Faces and posture.
*Not sure about this one, would like more explanation.*

Also you need to output a dictionary that has,

hand
spelling
sign
Portuguese
ASL
english
Quote

Do you currently have any way of keeping all this information in Sign 
Puddle?
SignWriter Studio can do
spelling
sign-LIBRAS
Portuguese
English
Source

I was hoping to add a second SignLanguage to do a dictionary with two 
sign languages but I haven't programmed that yet.

I am still working on finalizing the output for the dictionary. So I am 
looking for your input whether you use it or not.

Please fill me in where I am lacking and correct me where I am wrong.

Regards,

Jonathan

On 8/12/2014 4:47 PM, Jonathan Duncan wrote:
> Hi Charles,
>     I enjoyed your symposium *"Ordering Signs in Dictionaries" 
> http://www.signwriting.org/symposium/presentation0010.htmlgro
> * I was wondering if Steve and Val had been able to find you a 
> solution.  Val mentioned that she thought that Steve would have an 
> easy way for you to do your sorting.
>
>
> I would like to implement a sorting algorithm for SignWriter Studio as 
> I haven't implemented any yet and I am starting to produce a Honduran 
> Sign Language dictionary.
>
>
> I understood how you are doing the ordering comparing hand shapes, 
> comparing rotations, comparing facings, comparing facial areas, etc.  
> I like it very much.
>
>
> A couple things I wanted to ask.
>
> For your algorithm to work properly does the sign sequence of a sign 
> need to be filled out?  I am getting the impression that your sorting 
> could sort dictionaries without the sign sequence, is this assumption 
> correct?  Or would it sort signs according to the symbols in sign 
> sequence?  It doesn't seem to take into account the order of the 
> symbols in the sign sequence, is this correct?
>
> Also do you have another document comparing the other symbols like 
> movement symbols, etc?  If so could you send it to me?
>
>
> Thanks
>
> **
> -- 
>
> email: duncanjonathan at yahoo.ca <mailto:duncanjonathan at yahoo.ca>
> joyoduncan at gmail.com <mailto:joyoduncan at gmail.com>
> Cel Honduras: (504)3141-1171
> Tel USA: (347)875-8442
> Skype: yojoduncan
>
> SignWriter Studio <http://www.signwriterstudio.com/>
>

-- 

email: duncanjonathan at yahoo.ca <mailto:duncanjonathan at yahoo.ca>
joyoduncan at gmail.com <mailto:joyoduncan at gmail.com>
Cel Honduras: (504)3141-1171
Tel USA: (347)875-8442
Skype: yojoduncan

SignWriter Studio <http://www.signwriterstudio.com/>

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