Examples of Syllable 4: Detailed Sorting

Mon Sep 8 21:34:26 UTC 2014

SignWriting List
September 8, 2014

Hello Everyone -
I am glad to see you were able to automate this simplified sequence, Jonathan - that is good news.

And thank you Adam for your excellent answers...

Between caring for my Mom, who needs daily care, and trying to raise funds to pay those who need work, and to keep our server fees paid and so forth, and not being young myself (smile), I am generally choosing not to chat too much…and I don’t want to influence your new ideas…

Regarding not getting Charles’ email, I have no idea. Please check The SignWriting List Archives from time to time to see what messages you are missing:

SignWriting List Archives
http://www.signwriting.org/forums/swlist/

I can write to the tech support people at Valencia Community College later for you -

Regarding your question Jonathan, I am afraid I don’t understand the question - Can you ask it again in a very simple message?

Adam answered the way I might have answered. Adam is correct that is the detailed location is touching the palm of the hand or the tip of a finger then the symbols he shows below would be the detailed location.

But location can also be depth - how close and how far from the chest are those beginning hand positions - it can also be face and head - so if one is really parsing Syllable 4, which is for Location, then Location can be a variety of options and they are all marked by symbols that most of the time are not used in daily writing except the head and face might be…

There are not many examples of these Syllable 4 signs because from my personal research people didn’t lookup under Syllable 4 very much - it was rarely needed at all - most people look up by simple hand symbol and palm facing and that is it - and if they need a little more then they look up by movement symbol connected to the first hand symbol - but the location lookups are only really needed when there are many signs with close to the same SignSpellings -

Val ;-)

On Sep 8, 2014, at 2:22 PM, Jonathan Duncan <duncanjonathan at YAHOO.CA> wrote:

> It could be.  Depends what Val was thinking when she wrote the SignSpellingGuidelines-2008 I guess.
> 
> Thank you for showing me those two symbols.  I had never seen them before.
> 
> Jonathan
> On 9/8/2014 5:12 PM, Adam Frost wrote:
>> The only thing I can think of that has anything with relations to location on the hands is  for the fingers and  for the palm of the hand. They are found under SymbolGroup 29, which is not used in daily writing but for more detailed research. Is that what you were referring to?
>> 
>> Adam
>> 
>> On Sep 8, 2014, at 1:57 PM, Jonathan Duncan <duncanjonathan at YAHOO.CA> wrote:
>> 
>>> Hi Adam, 
>>>     I am working with Charles on finding a better way for sorting.  So that´s a bit what Charles was explaining to you some of the issues.  I know he also asked last week about locations on the hands.  I know Val was off for a well deserved break.  But we are still wondering about that too  I believe it´s the same as number 1 and 2 in Syllable 4.
>>> 
>>> I asked about the Syllable 4 below because am adding SignSpelling Sequence suggestion function to SignWriter Studio.   There will be two suggestion types,  one that follows Val´s sw0534-SignSpellingGuidelines-2008.pdf and another for what we are developping with Charles.
>>> 
>>> So far I have been able to automate a great part of setting the sequence for a sign from the symbols in a sign (no special location) for SignSpellingGuidelines-2008.  I have done Sylables 1-3 with a great measure of success so long as there aren´t more than four hands and a couple movement symbols.  For composite signs like "Good morning" in Honduran Sign Language it´s not great at all, but otherwise I think that it is a time saver.
>>> 
>>> But I got to Syllable 4: Detailed Sorting and I need some examples of signs sorted that have these features.  I am thinking that many of these would also be the special location symbol that aren´t used in everyday writing.
>>> 
>>> Thank you for the two examples you found.  That was helpful.
>>> 
>>> Regards,
>>> Jonathan
>>> On 9/8/2014 9:58 AM, Adam Frost wrote:
>>>> I’m not sure what you mean by 1-3. Do you mean the location on the hand? And what do you mean by Top-Down for the Face?
>>>> 
>>>> As for the neck, I found this sign with SignSpelling Sequence.
>>>> 
>>>> http://www.signbank.org/signpuddle2.0/searchword.php?ui=1&sgn=4&sid=9098
>>>> 
>>>> For the shoulder, I found this sign with SignSpelling Sequence.
>>>> 
>>>> http://www.signbank.org/signpuddle2.0/searchword.php?ui=1&sgn=4&sid=7005
>>>> 
>>>> Adam
>>>> 
>>>> On Sep 8, 2014, at 5:56 AM, Jonathan Duncan <duncanjonathan at YAHOO.CA> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> Hi,
>>>>>     Does anybody have any SignSequence examples for
>>>>> 
>>>>> Syllable 4: Detailed Sorting
>>>>> 1. Location Dominant Hand
>>>>> 2. Location Non-Dominant Hand
>>>>> 4. Face (Top-Down)
>>>>> 5. Neck
>>>>> 6. Shoulder
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> I´ve looked through the sign spelling sequences for the ASL and only found examples for
>>>>> 3. Head
>>>>> 7. Torso
>>>>> 8. Hips & Legs
>>>>> 
>>>>> Thanks,
>>> 
>>> ________________________________________________
>>> 
>>> SIGNWRITING LIST INFORMATION
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>>> Valerie Sutton SignWriting List moderator sutton at signwriting.org
>>> 
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>> 
>> ________________________________________________
>> 
>> SIGNWRITING LIST INFORMATION
>> 
>> Valerie Sutton SignWriting List moderator sutton at signwriting.org
>> 
>> Post Messages to the SignWriting List: sw-l at listserv.valenciacollege.edu
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> 
> -- 
> <afejciic.png>
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>          joyoduncan at gmail.com
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> Tel USA: (347)875-8442 
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> 
> SignWriter Studio
> 
> ________________________________________________
> 
> SIGNWRITING LIST INFORMATION
> 
> Valerie Sutton SignWriting List moderator sutton at signwriting.org
> 
> Post Messages to the SignWriting List: sw-l at listserv.valenciacollege.edu
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