Arabic-L:PEDA:Edumagic Responses

[Dilworth B. Parkinson]

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Arabic-L: Thu 07 Jun 2000
Moderator: Dilworth Parkinson <dilworth_parkinson at byu.edu>
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1) Subject: Edumagic Response
2) Subject: Edumagic Response
3) Subject: Edumagic Response
4) Subject: Edumagic Response

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1)
Date: 07 Jun 2000
From: alaa elgibali <elgibali at aucegypt.edu>
Subject: Edumagic Response

Professor Ratcliffe, commenting on the merits of one distance learning
Arabic site, was of the opinion that "so many native-Arabic speaking
teachers of > Arabic are unwilling or unable to teach the various registers
of Arabic > as they actually use them, and seem instead to regard knowledge
of > Arabic as knowlege of a body of arcane and abstruse lore of little or >
no use to anyone."

Perhaps Professor Ratcliffe and many of the professional working in the
field of teaching Arabic as a Foreign or a Second Language would agree that
many institutions and professors of Arabic are indeed making a serious
effort to present Arabic as a modern, living language.  In doing so, we are
guided, among many things, first by our students (their changing needs and
the continuos constructive criticism they  share with us), by our own
insights into the rubrics of the language, and by our desire to establish a
forum of genuine communication that is based on a current understanding of
contemporary culture and concerns.  In this, I believe native and non-native
of Arabic are equal.

Alaa Elgibali
Arabic Language Institute
American University in Cairo

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2)
Date: 07 Jun 2000
From:  Jeff HENSON <jhenson at cybercable.fr>
Subject: Edumagic Response

Hello list members,

I am new to the Arabic-l list. I've been "lurking" for a while now, and
thought it might be time to introduce myself. I've only been studying the
Arabic language for a short time, but have been exposed to it for several
years now. I have several "self-study" methods which I use in addition to
being tutored by an Arab friend. I am working with one book to learn MSA (this
is what I use with my Iraqi tutor) as well as another method (book &
cassettes) to learn the spoken Palestinian dialect, which I (attempt) to
practise with my wife and her family. (My wife is actually Lebanese, but the
Palestinian method was the closest I could find to her dialect).

I also had a look at the edumagic site, took the tests, etc. and I tend to
agree with Robert's opinion. My impression is that what they attempt to teach
would not be extremely useful to foreigners whose goal is to be able to
communicate naturally. I have, unfortunately, purchased several other methods
(books, tapes, cd roms...) that fall into the same category. I invested time
and money and always ended up giving up because when I tried using what I had
learned on my wife, her typical reaction was either a blank stare of
incomprehension, a smirk and a "NOBODY talks like *that*", or more times than
often, she would tell me how to say the same thing, but in the normal,
everyday spoken language.

I am fairly satisfied with the Palestinian method that I am currently using,
but would still be interested in finding something specifically designed to
teach the Lebanese dialect. I would also be interested in any information that
other list members might be able to give me about accredited distance learning
programs, as well as short term (no longer than 1 month) immersion programs in
Lebanon, Syria, Palestine or Jordan that offer classes in the spoken dialect
(not MSA).

Thanks in advance for your input.

Jeff HENSON (Abou-Jad)
Besançon, France

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3)
Date: 07 Jun 2000
From: Sanaa Ghanem <sanaa at aucegypt.edu>
Subject: Edumagic Response

[Moderator's Note: I didn't attach the attachment mentioned.  If you want
it, you can request it from Sanaa]

 Dear Robert

In response to your justified fears that learners of Arabic should not be
getting ((guidance from commercial interests without sufficient input from
disinterested academics and professional educators.)), I would like to put
your fears at rest.  EduMagic's programs and courses were designed, tested and
used by professionals in the fiedd of teaching Arabic as a foreign language
all the way.  The courses were designed 3 years ago by me, (a teacher of
Arabic at prestigeuos institutions since 1989), and attached is my CV.  While
developing the courses, my students and colleagues (at the American University
in Cairo) were testing them and their feedback is what finally shaped version
1 of the CD's.
Before we start teaching Arabic, our objectives have to be clear to all.  The
software series "Let's Learn Arabic" aims at teaching Modern Standard Arabic.
It does not aim at teaching collquial Arabic or the spoken Arabic that varies
by country.  Therefore, we agree with you in that we do not recommend this
series for learners who are aiming at learning the spoken variety of the
language.  Edumagic is developing another series for that purpose. ((For
students whose goal is communicative competence in modern spoken and written
Arabic the tests are completely inappropriate)).  Additionally, placement
tests are not learning tools, that is not their objective.  Their objective is
to help teachers place learners in the level that suits him or her best.
It is important to distinguish between pedagogy and content.  While the
programs are teaching Modern Standard Arabic, that is wrongfully described as
((teaching Quranic Arabic to non-Arab Muslims)), the methodologies are highly
interactive and communicative. First, let us define Modern Standard Arabic.
Modern Standard Arabic is the language variety that is used across all Arab
countries for most written communication as well as some formal
communication.  In other words, all Arab newspapers, most books, magazines and
reports are written in Modern Standard Arabic.  A person who lives in an Arab
country and who does not know how to use Modern Standard Arabic is considered
"illiterate".  So it is a necessity in Modern life in an Arab country.
"Quranic Arabic" is the Arabic of the Quran.  Modern Standard Arabic cannot be
referred to as "Quranic Arabic".  "Quranic Arabic" is limited to liturgical
purposes whereas Modern Standard Arabic is the medium used to discuss and
exchange information (motsly in the written form) related to modern life and
sciences.
Concerning teaching the dual form, if we agree that our objective was to teach
Modern Standard Arabic, then the dual forms of verbs and nouns have to be
taught.  EduMagic's placement test is divided into sections where each section
focuses on a particular skill in order to be able to place the learner at the
suitable course.
It may be of comfort for you to know that EduMagic has no intention of
ignoring the spoken registers of Arabic.  ((so many native-Arabic speaking
teachers of Arabic are unwilling or unable to teach the various registers of
Arabic)).  As a matter of fact, teaching the colloquial varitety is an
important part of our program.  This does not mean that Standard Arabic should
be overlooked.  We are developing several language tracks that learners can
choose from: Modern Standard Arabic, Islamic Arabic, Egyptian Colloquial
Arabic, Business Arabic and more ....
Thank you for your comments and I look forward to responding to any questions
either directly (sanaa at edumagic.com) or through this list.
Best regards
Sanaa Ghanem
Arabic Language Teacher
American University in Cairo

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4)
Date: 07 Jun 2000
From: zeinabib <zeinabib at aucegypt.edu>
Subject: Edumagic Response

Dear Colleagues


We have to admit that our field is suffering from shortage of computer
materials.
I am writing to to say that I am in favor of  "Let's Learn Arabic" series
by EduMagic, for learning Modern Standard Arabic.  The course, which is
found on 4 CD-ROM's, is well-designed and is comprehensive in nature.
I had the chance to see this program before its completion and Ms. Ghanem has
asked for feedback.  Maybe there are still few points that need to be worked
on more yet it is a good program due to the following reasons:

1.  Alphabet:
The program teaches how to pronounce and how to write every letter in
syllables (with the short and long vowels) and in the context of words.
An animation on writing every letter helps learners grasp the directions
of writing Arabic.
2. Vocabulary:
Six groups of topics related to a situation are given in addition to a
group of verbs.  Putting words together in semantically related groups
helps learners utilize the words in meaningful situations and hence
them.  Verbs are grouped by their form.  Every chapter presents a very
form.  Another very useful feature that we found was in the program's
flexibility where choosing the words that would be used in the exercises
and games.  This helps learners and teachers focus on certain words then
expand their knowledge gradually.  Also, it allows learners to move at
their own pace.
3. Conversation
This program focuses on two aspects: communicative language functions as
well as building a story that puts those language functions in use.  A
striking feature about the conversation program is that it presents more
than one story within every lesson.  All stories are built around one
theme, such as traveling, accommodation, etc..  The benefit of having
multiple stories is that it allows learners to review what they have
learnt but in a new environment.  The texts are skillfully built to aim
at re-enforcing the same language functions.
4.  Grammar:
It is so well-structured and easy to use that at last it is possible to have a
tool that would save us hours of repetitive tasks in class. The program
is basically divided into 2 sections: morphology and syntax.  The part
related to morphology presents the 10 verb forms as well as the
inflection of the nouns that were previously presented in the Vocabulary
CD.  The systematic presentation of verbs facilitates comprehension and
retention of Arabic verbs.
Syntax is presented in a highly interactive and innovative way.  This is
the first (and perhaps only) program that has utilized the functional
approach to teaching grammar.  Grammar is explained in terms of language
usage.  However, the program did not neglect the presentation of cases
and case endings - an important part in the acquisition of the grammar
of Modern Standard Arabic.  Yet, it was presented in an
innovative way that made this task an enjoyable part of the program to
learners.  Case endings were keynotes presented on a piano that we play
according to the set Arabic rules.
It was clear that learners enjoyed and benefited from those programs.
Teachers, being one of them, have highly recommended using those
programs to their students.  I highly recommend the program but also call for
constructive criticism so it can be even better.
Best regards
Zeinab Ibrahim
CASA Executive Director
American University in Cairo

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End of Arabic-L: 07 Jun 2000