[gothic-l] Basque==Visigoths ???

[Manuel Gutierrez Algaba]

On Sat, 30 Sep 2000, B. Gendler wrote:
> "Axeage " <axeage at hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > I also believed that by the time the Visigoths arrived and settled in
> > Spain and southern France, and the Ostrogoths in Italy that they were
> > no longer the same people (racially and ethnically) who crossed the
> > Baltic from Scandinavia due to intermarriage with iranians, huns,
> > slavs, romans, etc...but so far, all anthropological evidence I have
> > seen indicates otherwise.
>
>   We do know that they mixed, however, and not always through marriage
> either. Wulfila for instance, was not of Gothic descent. His ancestors were
> captives. Through the generations, their standings changed, so that by the
> time of Wulfila, he was considered a "Goth."
>   One thing to consider, apart from that, is that many of the peoples with
> whom the Goths mixed with were more probably other Germans with genetic
> origins similar to those of the Goths, i.e. Scandinavian, than say Iranians,
> for example. We could probably expect more of a mixing with Germanic peoples
> because the linguistic barrier would not be as great. This pertains mostly
> to joiners. Marriages probably took place within the tribe, or by plundering
> the women of other tribes.
>   A large influx of non-Gothic Germans into the Gothic nation would alter
> their genetic pool very lttle. As Bertil has shown us, most of these other
> tribes that the Goths would have had contact with also had Scandinavian
> origins.

These days I'm thinking about the Basques, those separatist guys of
Northern Spain.

My conclusion is that they must have lots of gothic blood in their veins.
Ok, some linguistic evidences:
- Mcarver posted that list of words where he says:
 aiskon    ask    assar Mont; eskatu Bas;
- The "traditional" basque soldier is named "Gudari" (from the Gotor,
Gautier,... family ?).

Then, the Basque nationalistics politicians are all day saying :
- Our RH is RH-, our blood is different.
- Our skulls are different
(they say this any day any time).

Then, it's true that basques tend to have blue eyes, big faces (with
big noses) and they're taller.

In fact, many of the points of Basque nationalism seem extracted from
"Reconquista" period (10 centuries ago). They say that the rest
of Spanish people are "arabs" or "moors", they claim to be pure blood,
and first nationalists claimed to be "more" Spanish than Spanish
themselves. Besides they're hyper-catholic, if you've seen the film
"The mission" with missions in Uruguay and Jesuits ... well, the expulsion
of Jesuits (who ruled missions) from the domains of King of Spain was
due to catholic conservative conspiracies in Basque country leaded by
Jesuist.

The Basque sports are weird:
- stone weight lifting (200 kg stones).
- wood cutting with axes.

And the culture is very scarce:
They have only a strange dance (dantzari)?

Basques are good metal workers, the basque country is/was a good
place with iron mines.

What's more? Their typical houses resemble a bit the German ones:
big, strong wood pillars, stony... Different houses from the rest
of North of Spain or South.

Weirdest thing is the language and their matriarcal system (the woman
has a lot of power).

Well, with all this isolated data I'll plot a story:

Century VIII
Arabs invade in only sixth years the whole Iberian peninsula.
Only North is left unconquered ( poor zones, no cities, warrior
peoples,...).
Part of the population of  Goth settlements in the North-centre moves
North. Goth kings had already fought Basques, Vitoria was a city
founded after a victory over them. And we know that Navarra hold large
Goth settlements.

The Visigoth idea of national state with national religion is
reinforced with the idea of national race. Goths mix with the remaining
_true_ Basques , they give them metal working habilities, military
habilities (Basque infantery was one of the best during Medieval Age),
and race.

Paradoxically enough, part of these heritage has been poisoned with
weird ideas.

As bibliography, I'd recommend Julio Caro Baroja books.

If the plot is true, Basque language holds more Gothic than we
could expect, I think they have "zu" (an evolved form for thou ??).

BTW, current Basque politicians claim to be "free of any indoeuropean
blood" (nobody can believe that, honestly).

And lastly, the "disaster" of Roncesvalles (Chanson of Roland, I think),
where the rearguard of Carlomagno (Charles Magno ?, the Frank emperor
of X century), who have his capital at Aachen (Aquisgran), was wiped
out by Basque-Goth troops, perhaps by that time they were starting to
be the same people.

As, basque historians/official culture are more worried trying to cut any
link with indoeuropean stuff, I think the only independent author
is Julio Caro Baroja(dead), banned in his own country and that has
made his ancestor Pio Baroja (great writer from late XIX) to be banned
too !

---
Regards/Saludos
Manolo
www.ctv.es/USERS/irmina    /TeEncontreX.html   /texpython.htm
/pyttex.htm /cruo/cruolinux.htm ICQ:77697936 (sirve el ICQ para algo?)





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