[gothic-l] Re: the Thuringians

[Andreas Schwarcz]

On 20 Nov 2002 at 8:27, faltin2001 wrote:

> > 
> Ok, that means that the rise in the importance of the Thuringians in 
> the alliance system of Theoderic was not the result of the defeat of 
> the Heruls. Instead, Theoderic seemed to have persued a policy of 
> building alliances with various peoples north of the Alps in 
> parallel. 
> 
> 
Dear Dirk, that is what he did. He married himself Clovis's sister Audofleda soon after 
Odoacer's death, when Clovis himself married the Burgundian princess Chrodehildis, 
and  gave his daughter Thiudugotho in marriage to Alaric II., king of the Visisgoths 
(probably 493/94). Her sister Ostrogotho married 496 the Burgundian heir to the throne 
Sigismund, with whom she had already been affianced in 490. Theodoric's sister 
Amalafrida married Thrasamund, king of the Vandals, around 500. See for this 
Wolfram, Die Goten, 306 f.
> 
> 
> 
> The defeat of the Heruli preceded Theodoric's peace 
> > with the emperor Anastasius in 510 and must be dated into the 
> second half of 509.
> 
> 
> So north of the Alps, Theoderic exercised some form of protectorate 
> over parts of the Alamanni and probably over the (emerging) Bajuvari. 
> Hence, those peoples stood in something of a dependent relationship 
> to the Ostrogoths in Italy. Theoderic also had alliances with the 
> Herulic kingdom in Moravia and the Thuringian kingdom in middle 
> Germany. While those two kingdoms were more assertive than the 
> Alamanni and Bajuvari at the time, they also were still subordinate 
> to the Ostrogothic kingdom.

I would not say subordinate, but Theodoric defined himself as ruler of the Roman West 
and they were his federates.
 What is known about the relationship 
> between Ostrogoths and Langobards? After desruction of the Herulic 
> kingdom the Langobards were in the most significant strategic 
> position. Yet, as far as I know, no direct diplomatic efforts were 
> made by the Ostrogoths targeted at the Langobards. Was the 
> Ostrogothic-Herulic alliance which ended with the defeat of the 
> Heruls in 509 still causing hostility between Langobards and 
> Ostrogoths afterwards? Where the Langobards too strong and assertive 
> after 509AD?

The Ostrogoths allowed some of the Heruls to join them after 509, which certainly 
strained their relations to the Longobards, and the latter were federates of emperor 
Anastasius. But  the Longobardic king Tato was dethroned and killed by his nephew 
Wacho soon after his victory, and the first wife of Wacho, Ranicunde, was a 
Thuringian princess. So we may assume Thuringian and Ostrogothic support for his 
revolt and an integration of the Longobards into Theodoric's diplomatic system by this 
Thuringian connection.

Kind regards
                          Andreas

> 
Ao.Univ.Prof.Dr.Andreas Schwarcz
Institut für österreichische Geschichtsforschung
Universität Wien
Dr.Karl Lueger-Ring 1
A-1010 Wien
Österreich
Tel.0043/1/42-77/272-16
Fax 0043/142-77/92-72



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