LL-L "Phonology" 2002.01.13 (02) [E]

[Lowlands-L]

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 L O W L A N D S - L * 13.JAN.2002 (02) * ISSN 189-5582 * LCSN 96-4226
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 A=Afrikaans Ap=Appalachian D=Dutch E=English F=Frisian L=Limburgish
 LS=Low Saxon (Low German) S=Scots Sh=Shetlandic Z=Zeelandic (Zeeuws)
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From: Sandy Fleming [sandy at scotstext.org]
Subject: "Phonology"

> From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
> Subject: Phonology
>
> You may remember that our Dutch-speaking friends insist that there is a
> phonetic difference between _f_ [f] and _v_ [v"] in Dutch?  While I do
> not doubt that they perceive it, I still find it confusing, because a
> devoiced /v/ ought to be voiceless, thus [f].  If it is a different

I think a Scots speaker might say the same about [W] and [w"].
What is now spelt <wh> in Scots was spelt <quh> in Middle Scots,
eg "wha" was spelt "quha" &c. The SND has a suggestion that this
spelling was due to the pronunciation [xW] - so the [W] could
actually be seen as devoiced due to the presence of the [x].

It goes on to say that "older speakers" can still sometimes be
heard to pronounce this vestigial [x] in emphatic speech -
although I'm not sure in what sense I'm an "older speaker"
as this was written before I was born! It's probably just a
facile expression. It's true, though, that Scots speakers are
still frequently heard pronouncing this sound with a light [x]
preceding it, or a perfectly audible [xW] when emphasised. This
probably makes the [W] seem qualitatively different from the [w"]
to Scots speakers, but you could approach it from the other
direction and say that the [x] of [xW] is deleted after a voiced
stop - so it still comes down to either approach being acceptable,
and it's still a matter of deciding which works best overall.

> phoneme it ought to have its own symbol, for the devoicing diacritic (a
> small circle in IPA, " in SAMPA) leads one to assume the result of a
> phonological rule, i.e., devoicing.  So, perhaps the IPA (here SAMPA)
> system is imperfect in that it does not show degrees of voicelessness,
> if there is such a thing.  To avoid such doubts I personally would, as I
> said, opt for consistent [W] in Scots.

I often think this - especially these days when phonetics is
studied using medical scanners and x-rays to measure exactly
what goes on during speech!

Another thing I often wish we had was a numerical, ie
"x, y (and maybe z) coordinate", notation for expressing
vowel positions in those trapezoid diagrams, rather than
having to draw them all the time - it doesn't seem a very
difficult thing to devise. I assume that, so far, linguists
are more interested in being able to write things alphabetically
than using numbers.

> I hope this helped, and I wish you the best with your project.

It did help, thanks!

I started putting "the project" up on the Web yesterday, so it
can now always be viewed at http://sandyfleemin.org/grammar/

There's practically nothing there yet, although what is there is
probably useful as far as it goes.

Sandy
http://scotstext.org
A dinna dout him, for he says that he
On nae accoont wad ever tell a lee.
                          - C.W.Wade,
                    'The Adventures o McNab'

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