LL-L "Lexicon" 2002.09.27 (14) [E]

[Lowlands-L]

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 A=Afrikaans Ap=Appalachian B=Brabantish D=Dutch E=English F=Frisian
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From: Daniel Prohaska <daniel at ryan-prohaska.com>
Subject: LL-L "Lexicon" 2002.09.27 (12) [E]

In the North-West Midland "standard" (vs. Lancashire dialect) of Manchester
on frequently hears my mum and dad /mI mUm @n dad/ in informal contexts,
whereas my father /mI fa:dh@/ is more formal, and /ma:I fa:dh@/ even more
so. Corresponding to /mI mudh@/ and /ma:I m at dh@/. Grandfather is /`grandad/
and grandmother is /nana/.

Yehes dheugh,
Dan

> From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
> Subject: Language changes
>
> This makes me want to ask if you have noticed similar trends in other
> varieties of English and in other Lowlands languages (e.g., "mother" ~>
> "mum", "father" ~> "dad" in other forms of English, and/or _mither_ ~>
> _mum_, _faither_ ~> _dad_ in Scots).  Outside the Lowlands area but within
> the Germanic group, I noticed that in Modern Icelandic _mamma_ and _pabbi_
> are often used where I would expect _mir_ 'mother' and _fair_ 'father'
> respectively, similarly _mame_ and _tate_ in place of (rather serious and
> distant) _muter_ 'mother' and _foter_ 'father' respectively in
> Yiddish, and,
> back in the Lowlands fold, oftentimes _ma_ and _pa_ where I would expect
> _vader_ and _moer_ respectively in Afrikaans.

This would be "ma" and "da" in Scots, I don't think I've
heard "mum" or "dad" used. There is also "pa" for "father".

"Mammie" /'ma:mI/ and "daddie" /'da:dI/ might also be used,
especially by young children or even grown women. In the
case of grown women I think these two words would only be
used when actually addressing the parent (in the "locative",
if you like).

"Mither" and "faither" wouldn't be normal when addressing
the parent in my Scots, although "mither" and "faither"
might be used in referring to them, or alternatively "ma"
and "da".

"Grandfather" is "granda", "papa" /'pa:p@/ or "grampa" as
well as "gran(d)faither".

"Grandmother" is "gran(d)ma", "grannie" or "gran(d)mither".

I've never heard the word "parent" used in Scots (it's always
either just "ma an da" or "mither an faither"), but Lorimer
uses it in his New Testament with the pronunciation /'pa:rent/.

Sandy
http://scotstext.org/

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From: Ruud Harmsen <rh at rudhar.com>
Subject:LL-L "Lexicon" 2002.09.27 (07) [E]

>Actually, as a footnote for those who are interested, the Romanian
letter
>you substituted with "ä" is an "a" with a _breve_ on top: "a",
which stands
>for a schwa-like sound.

True. See also:
http://www.phon.ucl.ac.uk/home/sampa/romanian.htm
or if your computer handles limited Unicode:
http://www.phon.ucl.ac.uk/home/sampa/rom-uni.htm
http://rudhar.com/sfreview/unigglen.htm

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From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
Subject: Lexicon

Thanks, Ruud.  But the "a" I sent seems to have been stripped of the breve,
at least when the mailing arrived in my box.  :(  I guess one of these days
we *will* all switch to Unicode, as befits a list that deals with language.

By the way, Sandy, I got _mum_ and _dad_ from an English-Scots dictionary --
and I did think it was odd because I expected _da_ as one of the variants at
the very least.  Goes to show you how reliable this dictionary is ...

Cheers!
Reinhard/Ron

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