LL-L "Language varieties" 2004.08.17 (08) [E]

[Lowlands-L]

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L O W L A N D S - L * 17.AUG.2004 (08) * ISSN 189-5582 * LCSN 96-4226
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A=Afrikaans Ap=Appalachian B=Brabantish D=Dutch E=English F=Frisian
L=Limburgish LS=Lowlands Saxon (Low German) N=Northumbrian
S=Scots Sh=Shetlandic V=(West)Flemish Z=Zeelandic (Zeêuws)
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From: Ruth & Mark Dreyer <mrdreyer at lantic.net>
Subject: LL-L "Language varieties" 2004.08.17 (05) [E]

Dear John,

Subject: Language varieties

> "Low German" is the name given to a group of languages and/or dialects
which
> arose mainly in what we now call Northern Germany, whose principal
ancestor
> is Old Saxon, and whose modern forms remain largely confined to this area
> despite a geographically wide use of Middle Low German during the
Hanseatic
> League period.
>
> "Old English", formerly called "Anglo-Saxon" is the name given to the
group
> of languages and/or dialects which arose in England and what we now call
> Southern Scotland following the invasion of this area by tribes from the
> near Continent who spoke a variety of West Germanic languages. Its
> subsequent development led to Modern English.
>
> Each of these definitions excludes the other.
>
> As far as I know there is no term for Low German and English, or Old Saxon
> and Old English, taken together. I suggest that no need has been found for
> either.
>
> Given that the issue is a matter of definitions, the mutual
intelligibility
> of the languages concerned and their intelligibility to speakers of other
> languages are irrelevant, though these things are evidently interesting in
> their own right.

I like this. It seems to me the term 'Low German' is just a trifle
over-exposed in default of a term embracing a slightly larger group of
related languages. It seems to me Low German is all too often a catch-net
for whatever didn't become 'High German'!

But hear me; I hope I'm not pre-empting some scholar's input here, but where
intelligiblity is the issue in consideration, & it may be inherantly, or at
the most peripherally, & where this issue is largely the product of a common
origin, then that should determine the subject.

In two matters, John, I would ask you to give Law. Continental Saxon &
Insular Saxon were nearer than sister-tongues, enough that English, at least
pre-Danelaw & pre-Norman English, & dialects derived from it, must fall
within the category, in the way that Old High German, & the dialects derived
from it do not, & modern Scandinavian languages, notwithstanding their
intelligibility, do not.

Inherent in the two definitions you present of Low German & Old English are
territorial, or geographical parameters, the same that I find I object to in
the case of Low German. Are they your own definitions?
The problem is, people move around. Shall I itemise?

Yrs Sincerely,
Mark

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