LL-L "Idiomatica" 2004.07.21 (03) [A/E]

[Lowlands-L]

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L O W L A N D S - L * 21.JUL.2004 (03) * ISSN 189-5582 * LCSN 96-4226
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A=Afrikaans Ap=Appalachian B=Brabantish D=Dutch E=English F=Frisian
L=Limburgish LS=Lowlands Saxon (Low German) N=Northumbrian
S=Scots Sh=Shetlandic V=(West)Flemish Z=Zeelandic (Zeêuws)
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From: John Baskind <jbaskind at mac.com>
Subject: Etymology

Beste, Ron en Mark:

Dankie virrie oophartige groete!

On Jul 19, 2004, at 10:23 PM, Lowlands-L wrote:

> In North Saxon dialects of Lowlands Saxon (Low German) we have _naars_
> (<Naars>, <Noors>, <Nors> etc.) and _maars_ (<Maars>, <Moors>, <Mors>
> etc.)
> 'arse' (American 'ass', as in 'backside'), based on _aars_, which is
> hardly
> ever used now.  Perhaps the _maars_ variant comes from _an dem aars_ >
> _an
> 'em aars_ > _am aars_ 'on the ...', perhaps from the "colorful"
> invitation
> _Lek/Lik my am aars!_ (<Leck/Lick mi am Aars!>, nowadays _... an'n
> ..._,
> dative forms having disappeared).  It's an invitation in reverse, so to
> speak.  I guess I can spare you the translation.
>
> How's this for "boers," John?
>
> Groete,
> Reinhard/Ron

Ja-nee!  Dis maar lekker boers!

(This is off-topic, being a semantic rather than an etymological query,
but I beg indulgence:)

I have chewed over this quintessentially Afrikaans expression (ja-nee)
for years, but have always been frustrated in my quest for information
on it's origins. I hope that someone here might be able to shed some
light.

Ja-nee is difficult to translate accurately, as it carries a wide range
of meaning, depending on the inflection and which of the two words is
emphasized. In the case above it provides  delighted
acceptance/agreement with a salient point; but it can also carry the
meaning of a considered acceptance of present realities, as in the case
below,  a wonderful series of advertisements from South Africa's
erstwhile governing Party which appeared in the Afrikaans Press during
the run-up to the epochal 1994 elections:

Ad 1, Full Page:

Ja

Ad 2, Full Page:

Nee

Ad 3, full page

Ja-Nee

Ad 4, full page

Ag, Ja.

Which begs the question of whether Afrikaans has (I"m not a linguist, I
just love language) been influenced by the tonal African languages it
has grown up with to develop, _beyond_ its European cousins.
those of  an entire substrate of tonal inflections

Groete, en nogmaals dank,
John

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From: R. F. Hahn <lowlands-l at lowlands-l.net>
Subject: Idiomatica

John, Lowlanders,

In Northern Germany this _ja-nee_ (literally "yes-no") is also very popular,
though it's popularity seems to be dwindling with the acceleration of
Germanization.  (People there don't seem to be as aware of this as I am,
because there are several years between my visits form overseas.)

I am pretty sure that this _ja-nee_ originated from Lowlands Saxon (Low
German), the earlier language of the land.  In this language I pronounce it
something like [dZQ:'nE.I] (approximately "jåh-ney" in English spelling, the
the "åh" as in "posh" Southern England English "father" or long Swedish
"a").  In "broadest" Missingsch (i.e., German on LS substrate) it's
pronounced the same, in "tamed" Missings or "broad" Northern German
[jQ:'ne:] ("yåh-neh"), and in more "sophisticated" Hamburg German [ja:'ne:].
I *have* heard the German(ized?) version _ja-nein_, but I am not sure if it
has the same semantic range.

As you said, this can convey all sorts of things, from being a filler to
mild disagreement, may even express surprise.  It seems semantically really
complex to me.  Much depends on context and intonation.  I could see someone
writing a voluminous dissertation about it.

I wonder if this is a general Continental Lowlands expression, if it is a
Saxonism in Afrikaans, or if it sprang up independently in the two
languages.  I suppose what we need to find out is if our friends in the
Netherlands and Belgium are familiar with it too.  Might our British friends
know of a thing like this in English and/or Scots (*_aye-na_?) dialects
even?

Thanks for bringing this up, John.

En, ja-nee, ek stem met Mark overeen: dis baie lekker om jy op hierdie lys
te hê!  Ons het meer Afrikaanse stemme nodig.

Groete,
Reinhard/Ron

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