LL-L "Etymology" 2008.02.23 (02) [E]

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L O W L A N D S - L  - 23 February 2008 - Volume 02
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From: foga0301 at stcloudstate.edu
Subject: LL-L "Etymology"

Hello all,

    I can relate to this -*hagen* question from my time in Pakistan.  In the
Punjab, rich people have public gardens named after them—the famous ones
from long ago, especially. They are called *baaghs*. In his book, *Just So
Stories*, Rudyard Kipling wrote of one of these that was owned by King
Solomon, himself. The setting establishes Solomon's title as ruler over all
the world (including the whales in the sea).  It's a precious piece of
literature since he shares this title equally with the Queen of Sheba, if I
remember right. They also have Arabic-sounding names in the story.  The
title says something about a butterfly stamping his foot (to
intimidate/impress his wife by making the world disappear). Ah, here it is
in full: http://www.boop.org/jan/justso/butter.htm.  These days, such royal
*baaghs* are tourist sites—places to remember the grandeur of the past.  If
I remember right, they all have the suffix –*baagh*.  Is that the Urdu/Hindi
equivalent of *hag*-? If so, it might be the oldest use of the word, and the
most prestigious.

    I'm playing with the keyboard trying to type in Hindi… there's what I
think spells the suffix/word –*baagh*  [अग]… no it's a soft "b" [बाग] in the
online dictionary—which goes for a range of enclosures [*paradise, vineyard,
orchard, rosary*] as well as the bridle of a horse (not sure why that fits
here).  And here's another dictionary's account: *garden, **grove, cluster
of trees, plantation*; also *children, family, offspring*; adj. *rejoicing*.
But when you add the verb *dikhānā*, its meaning shifts to: *to excite
desire and expectation by deceitful promises*.  And the verb *bāg**̠-kārī**
*shifts it to: *delude, deceive, cheat*.  Hum. What does this say about what
kings do in their gardens? This makes Kipling's tale all the more
meaningful.

Gael Fonken

Ron, you wrote:
 I don't think that Hagen ~ Haan ~ Hahn as a surname carried any negative
connotations, and I don't only say this because it's close to home. I
believe that originally it referred to a settler by or with a haw (enclosed
land). The negative stuff our Luc dredged up surely came later, or so I like
to think.

----------

From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
Subject: Etymology

Hi, Gael!

Thanks for the interesting information.

I believe Hindi *bāg ~ bāġ* (बाग ~ बाग़) and Urdu *bāġ *(باغ) are derived
from Persian (comprising Farsi, Dari and Tajik) *bāġ* (باغ) 'garden'. The
occurrence of the fricative equivalent of /g/ point to foreign, typically
Persian, origin. Bāġ is also a Persian-derived word in all languages of
Islamic Turkic peoples; e.g., Uyghur *b**āğ* (باغ, бағ), Uzbek *boğ* (боғ,
باغ), Kazakh *baq* (бақ), Kyrgyz *baq *(бак), Turkmen *b**āg* (баг, bag),
Azeri *bağ*, Turkish *bağ*, Tatar *bag* (баг), and Bashkir *bag* (баг).
These tend to denote stately gardens or parks, sometimes things like
'orchard' (competing with Arabic-derived *bost**ān*) or 'park', while
diminutive derivatives (e.g. Azeri *bağça*, Turkish *bahçe*) tend to denote
private gardens.

As you probably know, the influence of Persian language and culture,
including architecture and gardening, on those of South and Central Asia
cannot be understated.

Persian being Indo-European, I wonder if *bāġ *(باغ) is related with
European "park," Pferch, parricus, etc., a group we discussed not too long
ago. Consider Sanskrit words for "envelop," "fence off," "enclose" or
"enclosure": *paribhū *(परिभू), *parici *(परिचि), *paridhā *(परिधा), *parigrah
*(परिग्रह्), *parirudh *(परिरुध्), *paristr *(परिस्तृ), *parivrj* (परिवृज्),
*parizri* (परिज़्रि).

As for *"*garden*,"* I rather suspect that pre-Islamic Indo-Aryan used a
word with a very similar semantic development as Germanic **hag(Vn)*,
exemplified by Sanskrit (and also Pali) *dh**ā**r**ā* (धारा): 'margin' ,
'sharp edge (e.g. of a weapon)', 'rim', 'blade', 'fence or hedge of a
garden', 'garden'.

Regards,
Reinhard/Ron
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