LL-L "Idiomatica" 2009.08.20 (01) [EN]

[Lowlands-L]

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 L O W L A N D S - L - 20 August 2011 - Volume 01
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From: "Steven Hanson" <ammurit at gmail.com>
Subject: LL-L "Idiomatica" 2009.08.19 (02) [EN-NL]

The idea of ‘holding in high regard’ makes me think of Catalan, wherein one
might say ‘t’estimo’ for ‘I love you’.  ‘Estimo’ makes me think of English
‘esteem’, which leads ‘holding someone in high esteem’, which brings me back
full circle to Dutch ‘houden van’.  :-D
From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
Subject: Idiomatica

Hey, Steven!

My hunch is that Dutch *houden van ...* originally meant something like "to
think highly of ..." or "to hold ... in high regard," that it transitioned
to the sense of "to love ..." via the initial sense of "to like ...", i.e.
that it started of as a "typically Lowlandic" understatement.

In Low Saxon of Germany you can say *Ik hold vẹẹl **vun* ...
{person/thing}, in German correspondingly *Ich halte viel **von* ...
{person/thing} -- "I hold a lot of ... {person/thing}" -- in the sense of "I
think highly of ..." or just "I like ... (a lot)".

Dutch *verlieft (in)*, like German *verliebt (in)*, means 'in love (with)',
from the verbs **verlieven* (defunct? > *verlieft worden*) and *sich* *
verlieben* respectively 'to fall in love'. In some Low Saxon dialects of
Germany you can say *sik (in ...) verleven*. But to me it seems
idiomatically more authentic to say *sik (in ...) verkieken* (from the verb
*kieken* 'to look'), or *sik (in ...) vernarren* (from the verb *narren* 'to
fool' < nominal *Narr* 'fool'),

Regards,
Reinhard/Ron
Seattle, USA

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From: Ingmar Roerdinkholder <roerd096 at PLANET.NL>
Subject: LL-L "Idiomatica" 2009.08.9 (01) [EN]

Ah so it WAS silent here... I only follow the list via the archives, not via
email, so I thought maybe you hadn't have time to put the messages in the
archives.

Anyway, I don't know either how one would say I love you in Low Saxon of the
Netherlands. Just as Henry says,
ik holle van ou / dij, seems a direct translation from Standard Dutch.

Btw: in Belgian Dutch/Flemish, one hears very often: ik zie u graag, lit:
I'm seeing you with pleasure, meaning I love you/je t'aime. One can also
say: zie me graag! = love me!

Ingmar
*
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*From: M.-L. Lessing marless at gmx.de
Subject: LL-L "Idiomatica" 2009.08.19 (02) [EN-NL]

I agree with Jacqueline, you rather avoid outspoken words, or at most you
say "Ik heff di geern" or "Ik kann di good lieden" or "Ik bün di good".
Understatement is the thing here :-) Imagine a little embarrassment with it.
Platt is not so plain and outspoken in delicate matters, nor are the
plattdüütsch people. In delicate matters they are delicate.

Hartlich

Marlou


 From: Jacqueline Bungenberg de Jong Dutchmatters at comcast.net
Subject: LL-L "Idiomatica" 2009.08.9 (01) [EN]

Henry,

I think the question is: *do you say it*? A child, or an infatuated
youngster may say “ ik vind jou lief”, but “ ik houd van jou” is an entirely
different kettle of fish; just like “je t’aime” has a slightly different
color to it than “I love you”. ( Om van “Ich liebe dich” maar niet te
spreken! ). I have a sneaky feeling that people who are tied to the land,
who are pragmatic do not say it, rather they would show it by bringing their
loved one a bunch of flowers, building them a house or whistling at him/her
in a special way, or even getting her pregnant. Is that maybe the tone of “
le ton qui fait la musique” of lowland languages? And no, I am not being
flippant.



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