LL-L "Language varieties" 2012.08.01 (02) [EN-NDS]

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 L O W L A N D S - L - 01 August 2012 - Volume 02
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From: Ingmar Roerdinkholder <roerd096 at PLANET.NL>
Subject: LL-L "Language varieties" 2012.07.31 (01) [EN-NDS]

Dick anwered most of Joachim's questions about our Low Saxon's
pronunciation very well already.
A few remarks:
"ieje" = you  (sg. and pl.) is not ie + (Dutch) je, but merely an -e to
indicate emphasis, as in ik - ikke.
dim. suffix -ien has the pronunciation of a nasal ie, often it's pronounced
and spelt as just ie. I don't think it's long, but the nasal sound may give
that impression...

Ingmar

From: Dick van Faassen faasco at gmail.com
> Subject: LL-L "Language varieties" 2012.07.30 (02) [EN-NDS]
>
> Antwoord 02 Joachim Kreimer-de Fries.
>
> Moi Joachim, ik hope da'k hiermit *** (kiek hieronder) oen vroagen en
> opmarkings beantwoord hebbe.
>
> "Quote:  Agreed with that, though have I some question on pronunciation:
>
> 1.
> Diminutive suffix "-ien, -tien" and (plural) "-ies, ties" as in
> winterkoninkien, poossien, nussien, krummeltien
> and jonchies, hummelties, gedichies, ponies etc.
>
>
> ***Ponies is English, should have been “ponnies”.
> *** Bird = vogel;  little bird = vogeltien. [‘voɣəlti:n]
> ***Nest = nust;    little nest = nussien [‘nʌsi:n]
>
> This diminutive syllable seems to be a hybrid of
>
> Frisian/Westphalian/Vlaams "-ken" and NL "(t)je", right?  *** Right
>
> Therefore I tend spontaneously to pronounce it IPA [-kjən / -tjən,
> (t)jəs], but:
>
> Considering the spelling practice in the rest of the text the
> pronunciation would be [-i:n, -i:s] i. e. with long EN "ee" = DE
>
> long-i.     *** Right
>
> Which is the correct pronunciation? (Best in IPA-spelling.)   ***
> vogeltien  [‘voɣəlti:n]
>
> 2.
> /i'j/ vs. /ij/: the apostrophe between i and j in "bi'j" seems to
> indicate pronunciation [i:], i. e. [bi:] - but how the hell in the
> case of "hij" (EN he) - I would have liked it to be as EN he, NL ie,
> but this in your text is  already personal pronoun 2. person plural NL
> jullie, EN you DE ihr, so I fear it will be pronounced as NL "hij" i.
> e. [hɛɪ] - and analogously will be "zij", "wij", right?
>
>                 *** he is with me = hi’j is bi’j mi’j  [hɪj ɪs bɪj mɪj]
>                 *** This is the short [ɪ] like in hip, lip, whip etc.
>                 *** Ich bin = ik bin;  not pronounced as ie !  [ɪk bɪn]
>                 *** Du bist (DE) = ie bint [i: bɪnt] (SDZ)
>                 *** Ihr seid (DE) = ie bint  (SDZ)                   =
> jullie zijn (NL)
>
> But on the other hand you wright (wrote?) "En doar binne wi'j zo
>
> benauwd van ewörden" , “Hi'j is die kaante uut egaone” and "mi'j" (in
> “Wat he’j bi'j
> mi'j bi'j ’t nust te zuuken, ieje?!” - what seems to indicate the
> prono [vi:] as EN "we" LS "wi", [hi:], [mi:] like in EN we, he, me LS
> wi, mi.
>
>    *** he’j = heb jij = hast du.  “Ieje” [‘i:jə]  ist auch “du” or ” you”
>
> BTW: "ieje" seems to be some aggressive reduplicating "ie" NL "jij" EN
> "thou", DE "dudu" - if not "du Arsch", NL literally "jullie-jij".
>
> *** This  is correct; here it is ment:  You,   the angry way..
> ***  “Jullie” is also “oen”  e.g. (GB) Your house = (NL) Jullie huis =
> (SDZ) Oen huus.  (oe like in book)
>
> Short lesson Sallaands (SDZ)   I feel like a teacher, (Grin)
>
> Mit de hartelukke groetn van
> Dick.
>

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From: Ingmar Roerdinkholder <roerd096 at PLANET.NL>
Subject: Website

Voici an interesting site "Taaltoerisme" (Language Tourism) by Gaston
Dorren:

http://taaltoerisme.wordpress.com/

Ingmar

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