LL-L "Etymology" 2012.08.15 (01) [EN]

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 L O W L A N D S - L - 15 August 2012 - Volume 05
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From: Dick van Faassen faasco at gmail.com
 Subject: LL-L "Etymology" 2012.08.14 (03) [EN]

Hi Lowlanders,

Malayan words found their way to the Dutch Royal Navy.
Because of service in the former Dutch East Indies, the malayan
language was mostly the only way to talk with natives. Surabaya was
the most important naval base in Indonesia. Although the Javanese had
their own language, most of them were bilateral and spoke " Maleis" as
well.
When parts of the ship had been painted, someone wrote on the deck in
chalk: "Awas pakean - tjet baru". (Be aware of your clothes, fresh
painted.) Painting was :tjetten. Being payed was "katje halen" (gadjih
= salary) etc. etc.
When we were called into Naval service (1951), we had to learn basic
"Maleis" even if you never were send to the East, as Indonesia became
independant before (1949).

Best regards,

Dick.

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From: Mark and Ruth Dreyer mrdreyer at telkomsa.net
Subject: LL-L "Etymology" 2012.08.14 (03) [EN]

Dear Lowlanders; Jacqueline, Ingmar, Elaine & Ron:

Subject: LL-L "Etymology"

I was pleased to be awoken from my crypt with this question. Issues
involving both Afrikaans & the Far East *will* kick me up.

Regarding 'Nooi':

I'm not certain I don't hold with Ron in this matter. The jump from an
initial 'D' to initial 'N' seems to me a bit of a stretch, & unnecessary,
even a bit laboured. What Boshoff & Nienaber identified as Fries & Chambers
called Anglo Saxon, 'nonke' & 'nunna', along the Indo-European Line appears
to be more pertinant - it It is an old, old string in the language-line &
owes nothing to the Latin 'Domina'; & moreover it starts with 'N'. I recall
another M E usage, I think, in which a girl-child is addressed as 'nunkin'.

It often happens that the 'Lower Classes' are a tad more conservative in
language & cultural matters that the more fashionable 'Upper Crust'.
Afrikaans, I am told (aside from the 'baby-talk' aspects), strikes
Nederlanders as rather Old-Fashioned. I'm sure the Slamaaiers are too (only
I trust 'Class' is no longer an issue).

I think, & Ron could fill us in here, I suspect, that *if* 'Nonja'
*isn't*native to the pre-Colonial "Javanese" tongue, it is then more
likely a
borrowing into the Batavian Trade Argot from the dialects of the North-Sea
littoral of Europe rather than the Mediterranean/Romance regions.

As for 'Baie' / 'Banjak':

I can only report that my grandmother, with a basically 'Swartland',
'Riebeek-Wes' & 'Wellington' background, did not say 'baie' (as we
Transvalers do), or 'banje', but something more like 'baing'.

Thanks Ron, for that heart-stirring list of the root-stock of the Cape
Slamaaier - most of whom, I might note, landed up here as political
prisoners, for getting opstandig about being 'colonised' back Home. I think
the only ones excepted were the Balinese, who got 'incorporated' too late
to join the rest, it being about 1900, & the Cape long since a British
possession.

All Yrs,
Mark

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