LL-L "History" 2012.08.14 (05) [EN]

[Lowlands-L]

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 L O W L A N D S - L - 14 August 2012 - Volume 05
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From: Ingmar Roerdinkholder <roerd096 at PLANET.NL><kevin.caldwell1963 at verizon.net>
 Subject: LL-L "History" 2012.08.14 (04) [EN]

Yes, our colonial history brought a lot of exotic people to the
Netherlands. The Javanese Surinamese for instance, but many more came
directly from  the former Dutch East Indies, I think between 5 and 10 % of
the Dutch has an Indonesian our mixed Dutch-Indonesian background. There's
also a big group from the Moluccas here, who have already Melanesian
influences, and also Papuas from New Guinea, which was Dutch until 1964.
And a lot of Chinese from Indonesia as well. The Javanese Surinamese are
Muslims,  most of the others are Christians, although most inhabitants of
Indonesia are Muslims. The Javanese speak Javanese, Dutch or Sranan Tongo
(Surinamese creole), the "Indos" usually Dutch and some Malay, the
Moluccans have their own form of Malay. The Chinese speak Dutch.
An even bigger group of immigrants from Suriname in the Netherlands are the
so-called Hindostanen, recruited originally from former British India in
the same way as the Javanese.
But for the average Dutchman, a typical Surinamer is still a black Creole
descendant from African slaves, speaking Sranan Tongo. There are also the
so-call Bush Negroes who really live more or less as their African
ancestors, speaking their own English or Portuguese based creoles like
Ndjuka and Saramaccan. The Surinamese creoles are the most original and
interesting of the creole languages, their European origins are hardly
recognizable.

Btw as Ron wrote about the Javanese surname of Ramoni Kromowidjojo: it was
earlier Kråmåwidjåjå.
The darkening from long a into an o like sound must be kind of a universal
trend: we see it very strongly in Low Saxon, Persian (Farsi) and Javanese.
Also in Somalian I think, because I know many Somalian girls whose name
ends in -o where Arabic has -a:  Hibo, Halimo, Fadumo etc.

Ingmar

 From: Kevin & Cheryl Caldwell kevin.caldwell1963 at verizon.net
> Subject: Sports and Culture
>
> I  learned something interesting by way of the recent Olympic Games. One
> of the top female swimmers in the world is from the Netherlands – her name
> is Ranomi Kromowidjojo. That name didn’t sound particularly Dutch to me (to
> be honest, her surname looks a little Slavic to me, but apparently that was
> a red herring), so I did a little internet research and discovered that she
> is of mixed Dutch-Javanese Surinamese origin, but born and raised entirely
> in the Netherlands. There’s some interesting history there that I wasn’t
> aware of before – Javanese workers were recruited in the late 19th century
> to work on plantations in Suriname. A lot of their descendants moved to the
> Netherlands in the 1970s.
>
> Kevin Caldwell
>
> Laurel, MD USA
>
> ----------
>
> From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
> Subject: History
>
> Hi, Kev,
>
> Kromowidjojo (> Modern Spelling Kromowijoyo < earlier Kråmåwidjåjå) is a
> "very Javanese" name.
>
> Javanese used to be predominant in about three fourth of the Isle of
> Java's eastern part and is still a vibrant language there. Sundanese
> covered most of the western part of the island, with the exception of
> Batavia, today's Jakarta. (These are parts of our world and humanity I hold
> in particularly high esteem.) "Malay" varieties have been dominating the
> Batavia area, today's Jakarta area, for quite some time, and --- simply
> speaking -- .this is how the official language of Indonesia became Bahasa
> Indonesia ("language of Indonesia"), a subset of the Malay language.
>
> More information:
> Malay: http://lowlands-l.net/anniversary/malay-info.php
> Baba Malay: http://lowlands-l.net/anniversary/baba-info.php
> Malay (general): http://lowlands-l.net/anniversary/indonesian-info.php
> Malay (Indonesian) 1: http://lowlands-l.net/anniversary/indonesian.php
> Malay (Indonesian) 2: http://lowlands-l.net/anniversary/indonesian.php
> Malay (Indonesian) 3:http://lowlands-l.net/anniversary/indonesian.ph
> Sundanese: http://lowlands-l.net/anniversary/sunda-info.php
> Javanese: http://lowlands-l.net/anniversary/bali-info.php
> Balinese: http://lowlands-l.net/anniversary/bali-info.php
>
> Regards,
> Reinhard/Ron
> Seattle, USA
>

----------

From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
Subject: History

Thank you, dear Ingmar, for adding this important historical information
for everyone!

It is imperative that all of us Lowlanders understand and reconcile with
these phases of history. In my (longish) life all over the world  I've been
forced to deal with it on the basis of general North European (including
British, Dutch, Belgian, German and Danish) colonialism.

It is not a matter of which colonizing nation is more guilty than the next.
It's a matter of never doing it again. (Sorry! I'm now stepping down from
the pulpit.)

On the bright side, even these dire situations of colonial injustice have
spurned incredibly beautiful beginnings, culturally and linguistically ...
and ... and ...

I would *love* for us to talk more about that.

Regards,
Reinhard/Ron
Seattle, USA

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