LL-L "Etymology" 2014.05.19 (01) [EN]

[Lowlands-L]

=====================================================
 L O W L A N D S - L - 19 May 2014 - Volume 01
lowlands.list at gmail.com - http://lowlands-l.net/
Posting: lowlands-l at listserv.linguistlist.org
Archive: http://listserv.linguistlist.org/archives/lowlands-l.html
Encoding: Unicode (UTF-08)
Language Codes: lowlands-l.net/codes.php
=====================================================

From: Marcel Bas <marcelbas at gmail.com>
Subject: LL-L "Etymology" 2014.05.18 (01) [EN]

Good evening, Ron,

In Ancient Greek we have the cognate 'phōgein', which denotes 'to bake'
and 'to grill'. So I wonder if the connotation of 'baking dough' is not a
later development.

In Dutch we also have the additional meaning of "to adhere", "to
stick" that you find in Low Saxon, although I can only think of a
metaphoric case, now: the Dutch expression "gebakken zitten" means that a
person is secured, unlikely to leave his or her position. A person can
'zitten gebakken' when he has a good, steady job.

A perhaps more recent development is the expression 'het zit er
ingebakken', i.e. "It is baked in" (in a person). The expression refers to
a habit that is not easy to get rid of. "Het zit er zo ingebakken" = it is
a strong habit, it is hard to break with it.

Lastly, I wonder why Standard German has 'backen', when Old High German,
had 'bachhan', and Bavarian has 'bacha'. Is 'backen' perhaps a Low German
loanword?

Best regards,

Marcel.

-----------

From: Rader, James <jrader at m-w.com>
Subject: LL-L "Etymology" 2014.05.18 (01) [EN]

Ron-  Note that the Continental West Germanic forms have the outcomes of a
geminate consonant (*bakk-), opposed to Old English *bacan *with a single
consonant.  This etymon must be of near-Indo-European age, because Greek
*phṓgō,* “bake, roast,” is directly comparable.  It seems very unlikely to
me that a word this old would have referred primarily to the firing of
bricks/tiles—an advanced, almost industrial activity—and secondarily to the
baking/roasting of food.  See Seebold’s revision of Kluge’s etymological
dictionary of German (the 24th or later edition), if you have access to
it—it has thoughtful comments on this etymon.  Best, Jim Rader

=========================================================
Send posting submissions to lowlands-l at listserv.linguistlist.org.
Please display only the relevant parts of quotes in your replies.
Send commands (including "signoff lowlands-l") to
listserv at listserv.linguistlist.org or lowlands.list at gmail.com
http://linguistlist.org/subscribing/sub-lowlands-l.html .
http://www.facebook.com/?ref=logo#!/group.php?gid=118916521473498
==========================================================
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://listserv.linguistlist.org/pipermail/lowlands-l/attachments/20140519/30043338/attachment.htm>