WHEEL.bair.uh? (was "wheel barrels?")

[Thomas Paikeday]

I deny Dennis Preston's major premise, "salva caritate" that is!

What happens in cases where "barrel" and "barrow" don't fall together? You
can't deny the existence of something that exists for millions of people
just because it doesn't exist for you. Why not also deny the existence of
other people themselves because even if they argue they exist because they
think or for whatever other reason, that's not existence for you. Does
"dInIs" exist in name or in person?

T.M.P.


----- Original Message -----
From: "Dennis R. Preston" <preston at MSU.EDU>
To: <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
Sent: Wednesday, August 11, 2004 5:06 PM
Subject: Re: WHEEL.bair.uh? (was "wheel barrels?")


> ---------------------- Information from the mail
header -----------------------
> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> Poster:       "Dennis R. Preston" <preston at MSU.EDU>
> Subject:      Re: WHEEL.bair.uh? (was "wheel barrels?")
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
>
> Tom is  wrong. As I showed in my previous post, after 'barrel' and
> 'barrow' fall together, there is absolutely nothing to keep one from
> being heard as the other (with the exception of the lexical frequency
> and familiarity facts larry has touched on and which I happily
> concede).
>
> On the second point, I believe I showed this "lapse" (sigh!) specifically.
>
> dInIs
>
>
>
> >1. I don't think ease of pronunciation has anything to do with the
> >barrow/barrel confusion; it may have more to do with how the words are
heard
> >spoken. Also, whereas "barrel" is heard as "barrow" by me and lots of
> >English users from my linguistic background (no questions allowed about
this
> >murky issue please!) the reverse doesn't seem possible, i.e, "barrow" is
not
> >heard as "barrel."
> >
> >2. Incidentally, the variant pronunciation of "barrow" as (BAIR.uh, in my
> >transcription) given in dictionaries compiled in the mid-1900's (Kenyon &
> >Knott, 1953, probably influenced by Webster's Third, 1961) -- how common
is
> >it in current North American English? Does everyone say a compound word
such
> >as "wheel barrow" as (WHEEL.bair.oh) all the time or, esp. in rapid
> >conversational style, lapse into (WHEEL.bair.uh)?
> >
> >TOM
> >
> >----- Original Message -----
> >From: "Laurence Horn" <laurence.horn at YALE.EDU>
> >To: <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> >Sent: Wednesday, August 11, 2004 11:17 AM
> >Subject: Re: wheel barrels?
> >
> >
> >>  ---------------------- Information from the mail
> >header -----------------------
> >>  Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> >>  Poster:       Laurence Horn <laurence.horn at YALE.EDU>
> >>  Subject:      Re: wheel barrels?
>
>  -------------------------------------------------------------------------
-
> >-----
> >>
> >>  At 10:41 AM -0400 8/11/04, Thomas Paikeday wrote:
> >>  >Bethany,
> >>  >
> >>  >FWIW, here is my explanation of why you hear "wheel barrow" as "wheel
> >>  >barrel":
> >>  >
> >>  >The "l" sound in that position is rounded, so is "w". The "-ow"/"-el"
> >>  >confusion, I believe, is borne out in similar phonetic contexts
including
> >>  >"-al", "-il", "-ol", -"ul", and "-yl" if someone will supply examples
in
> >>  >support of or against this claim by a non-phonetician.
> >>  >
> >>  >TOM PAIKEDAY
> >>  >www.paikeday.net
> >>
> >>  Tom, I'm not sure I buy this, however persuasive the phonetic
> >argumentation.
> >>
> >>  My wife purchased a wheelbarrow earlier this summer and since then
> >>  has referred to it consistently as a wheelbarrel.  (This surprised me
> >>  because she's from Greenwich, CT and doesn't have all that many
> >>  "folk" pronunciations in her dialect.)  I just checked and she
> >>  confirmed that she (like others who have commented) would always
> >>  *spell* it as "wheelbarrow" but usually *pronounces* it as
> >>  wheelbarrel.  She claims (essentially like Tom) that it's "easier to
> >>  say" as 'barrel", but when I grilled her on whether she'd say "bow
> >>  and arrel" because it's easier than saying "bow and arrow", she
> >>  acknowledged she'd be extremely unlikely to do so.  So I think the
> >>  folk etymological link with "barrel" is crucial in the former case,
> >>  whatever the phonetic motivation.
> >>
> >>  Larry
>
>
> --
> Dennis R. Preston
> University Distinguished Professor
> Department of Linguistics and Germanic, Slavic,
>         Asian and African Languages
> Wells Hall A-740
> Michigan State University
> East Lansing, MI 48824-1027 USA
> Office: (517) 353-0740
> Fax: (517) 432-2736