[Ads-l] Definition OTY

Mark Mandel markamandel at GMAIL.COM
Wed Aug 19 12:14:14 EDT 2020


I don't think Moynihan's use is the newer sense. I can say what I want
because *it's true*.

MAM

On Tue, Aug 18, 2020, 2:28 PM Laurence Horn <laurence.horn at yale.edu> wrote:

> I know we’ve had threads on this in the past (e.g. “I deny the fact
> that…”), and I suspect you’re right in that this non-committal use of
> “fact” is increasing.  In some contexts “claim” can be used as a
> non-presuppositional alternative to “fact”, but of course not all
> propositions correspond to overt claims.  And as you say, “proposition” is
> rather non-colloquial.  Of course, if there can be alternative facts,
> there’s no reason not to accelerate the trend.  As Daniel Patrick Moynihan
> didn’t quite say,
> “You are entitled to your own opinions, but you are not entitled to your
> own facts. I am, though.”
>
> LH
>
> > On Aug 18, 2020, at 2:04 PM, Mark Mandel <markamandel at GMAIL.COM> wrote:
> >
> > In general, I hear "fact" being used more and more often to mean
> something
> > like "proposition" in the logical sense. And the fact that I have to
> > describe the usage that way illustrates why the usage is spreading: we
> have
> > no colloquial word for the concept.
> >
> > MAM
> >
> >
> > On Sun, Aug 16, 2020, 3:17 PM Jonathan Lighter <wuxxmupp2000 at gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> >
> >> Remember "Truth is not truth"?   Remember "alternative facts"? :
> >>
> >>
> >>
> https://www.thedailybeast.com/trump-chief-of-staff-mark-meadows-says-lack-of-evidence-of-mail-in-voting-fraud-is-the-definition-of-fraud
> >> :
> >>
> >> “But there’s no evidence of widespread voter fraud,” Tapper added after
> >> Meadows reiterated his concern with voter rolls.
> >>
> >> “There’s no evidence that there’s not either. That’s the definition of
> >> fraud, Jake.”
> >>
> >> See, undetected fraud is the worst fraud, so if there's no evidence of
> >> fraud, that means the fraud has gone undetected.
> >>
> >> Extraordinary claims require undiscovered evidence.  Absent evidence is
> >> evidence of non-absence.
> >>
> >> JL
> >> --
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> "If the truth is half as bad as I think it is, you can't handle the
> truth."
> >>
> >> ------------------------------------------------------------
> >> The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
> >>
> >
> > ------------------------------------------------------------
> > The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------
> The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
>

------------------------------------------------------------
The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org


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