[gothic-l] Re: Names of Heruls

[Troels Brandt]

--- In gothic-l at y..., dirk at s... wrote:
> I am not claiming anything. I just pointed out some observations
which
> lead me to belief that Procopius's report about the Heruls may be
just
> as dubious as some of his other writing.

Dirk,

I am glad to hear that, as the basis of your arguments regarding your
use of the royal names is obvious now. Your question about the value
of Procopius as source based on the theories of Walter Goffart has
already been answered by Andreas Schwarcz in February at this list in
MSG 3367, 3374 and 3381. I am not able to improve his arguments.

However my questions had primarily another purpose. I have already
this morning concluded about the Germanic character based on the
answers I got, and comments have also been made about two other
possible traces: An influence in 1-2 names from Asia Minor, and a
connection in 1-4 names to the Harudes - both may be explained by the
Herulian history. Maybe other listmembers have further ideas?

Regarding the Harudes:

> I read Taylor's article before and find that it is not exactly a
> piece of brilliance.

Hm! Bertil has made a comment on that.

> I know that he thinks that Aruth and Aordos relate to
> the tribal name of the Harudes. However, he forgets something,
Harudes
> are mentioned possibly on Jutland and definitely in Lower Saxony,
> but never in Thule, i.e. Norway.


I am not able to follow this argument. The Heruls were mentioned in
Thule after 500AD, but the Harudes in Jutland and in Lower Saxony
were from a much earlier phase. If the Heruls were separated from the
Harudes in the 3rd century in Jutland this will explain the von
Friesen/Broendsted-theories, an expulsion by the Danes, the Western
Heruls, the name of the Heruls (Harja-?), the similarities in
language between Crimea and Northeastern Saxony, the relationship
between Saxons, Thueringians, Lombards and Heruls, the -lev/-leben-
names etc.. Actually you wrote something similar two weeks ago and I
made a counterproposal!! I remember your earlier discussions, but I
must confess that I have never studied the Harudes and maybe a
discussion is a subject for Germanic-List.

Troels



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