[Lingtyp] uses of first plural exclusive pronouns

Tue Jun 23 21:08:24 UTC 2015

don’t forget the other paper in the same volume:

Cysouw, Michael. 2005. A typology of honorific uses of clusivity. In Elena Filimonova (ed.) Clusivity, 213-230. Amsterdam: Benjamins. 

https://benjamins.com/#catalog/books/tsl.63/main
http://www.cysouw.de/home/articles.html

best
michael

————————
Prof. Dr. Michael Cysouw
Forschungszentrum Deutscher Sprachatlas
Philipps Universität Marburg
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————————

> On 23 Jun 2015, at 16:26, Alex Francois <francois at VJF.CNRS.FR> wrote:
> 
> dear Zach, dear Kilu,
> 
> Two general references about that sort of pronominal syncretism would be:
> 	• Baerman, Matthew, Dunstan Brown, and Greville G. Corbett. The syntax-morphology interface: A study of syncretism. Vol. 109. Cambridge University Press, 2005.
> 	• Cysouw, Michael (2005). Syncretisms involving clusivity. In Elena Filimonova (ed.), Clusivity: Typology and case studies of the inclusive–exclusive distinction, 73–111. New York: Benjamins.
> 
> The pattern Kilu mentioned cannot be found in northern Vanuatu languages;  but I came across it as I did fieldwork in the Solomons.  Indeed, the 3 languages spoken on Vanikoro (Oceanic, Temotu) show a regular pattern in their subject-indexing prefixes  (S/A):
> 	• 1exc:du is collapsed with 2du, and 1exc:pl with 2pl
> 	• 1inc:du is collapsed with 3du, and 1inc:pl with 3pl
> The facts themselves are briefly mentioned in a paper
> François, Alexandre. 2009. The languages of Vanikoro: Three lexicons and one grammar. In Bethwyn Evans (ed). Discovering history through language: Papers in honour of Malcolm Ross. Pacific Linguistics 605. Canberra: Australian National University. Pp.103-126.  [online]
> 
> As for the interpretation, it was the object of a conference presentation:
> François, Alexandre. 2014. Person syncretism and impersonal reference in Vanikoro languages. Paper read at 6th ed. of Syntax of the World's Languages (SWL6), Universitá di Pavia, Sept 2014.  [online]
> 
> In that talk, I proposed two terms to label the language-specific categories defined by these mergers:
> 	• "dislocutive"  {1exc, 2}:  a group in which Speaker and Addressee behave differently
> 	• "collocutive"  {1inc, 3}:   a group in which Speaker and Addressee behave identically
> Considered separately, each of these two patterns of syncretism is also attested in a few other languages in the world;  
> but I haven't found any other language that combines the two syncretisms in such a neat and regular system as on Vanikoro.
> 
> best,
> Alex
> _________
> Alex François
> LACITO-CNRS, France
> Australian National University, Canberra
> Personal homepage
> __________________
> 
> 2015-06-23 "Sandra Auderset" <sandrauderset at gmail.com>:
> 
> Dear Kilu,
>  
> This is also found elsewhere in the world, although in agreement forms and not in pronouns:
> - in Banjal (Central Atlantic; Senegal):	1PL.EXCL = 2PL (agreement with S/A)
> - in Udihe (Tungusic, Russia): 		1PL.EXCL = 2PL (agreement with S/A)
>  
> However, there is at least one language that collapses first person inclusive with second person in agreement (might helpful for theoretical considerations):
> - Cubeo (Tucanoan; Colombia):  		 1PL.INCL = 2 (agreement with S/A; concernces only one of several sets of forms)
> 
> Best,
> Sandra
> 
> 
> 
> 2015-06-23 14:38 GMT+02:00 Bill Palmer <bill.palmer at newcastle.edu.au>:
> 
> Dear Kilu
> 
>  
> 
> I’m pretty sure I’ve seen this in a few Meso-Melanesian languages, though I can’t bring to mind off hand which ones. I’ll try to have a look and post again. It’s hard to say why this happens, but I suspect that they are collapsing into a non-3rd person category. I suspect that 1incl is not involved because that category is a little more complex than simply a group of individuals including one or other of the SAPs.
> 
>  
> 
> best
> 
> Bill
> 
>  
> 
> From: Lingtyp [mailto:lingtyp-bounces at listserv.linguistlist.org] On Behalf Of Kilu von Prince
> Sent: Tuesday, 23 June 2015 10:26 PM
> To: Zachary O'Hagan
> Cc: lingtyp at listserv.linguistlist.org
> Subject: Re: [Lingtyp] uses of first plural exclusive pronouns
> 
>  
> 
> Dear Zach, and dear colleagues,
> 
>  
> 
> I'm not aware of the exact phenomenon you're looking for, but I'd like to piggyback on your question, because I have an observation that I find much weirder and have so far not been able to make any sense of:
> 
>  
> 
> In Dalkalaen (Oceanic, spoken in Vanuatu), the first person exclusive pronouns for paucal and plural number are being collapsed with the corresponding second person pronouns. Are there other languages with this property? Does anyone have a theory as to why this might happen?
> 
>  
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Kilu
> 
>  
> 
> On Fri, May 29, 2015 at 1:34 PM, Zachary O'Hagan <zohagan at berkeley.edu> wrote:
> 
> Dear colleagues,
> 
>  
> 
> It is known that first plural inclusive pronouns can be used for polite first- or second-person reference in some languages.  I am searching for instances in any language in which a first plural *exclusive* pronoun can be used for polite *third*-person reference, or for instances in which a third-person pronoun can be shown to originate historically in a first plural exclusive pronoun.  Possible references are much appreciated.
> 
>  
> 
> Regards,
> 
>  
> 
> -Zach O'Hagan
> 
>  
> 
> --
> 
> Zachary O'Hagan
> Graduate Student
> Department of Linguistics
> University of California, Berkeley
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
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