[Lingtyp] Query: Elided Intensification
Pier Marco Bertinetto
piermarco.bertinetto at sns.it
Mon Apr 12 11:19:05 UTC 2021
Frans's comment made me realize that one has the same in Italian:
"Come" is a comparative marker (an equalizer):
Gino è alto come Piero
'G. is as tall as P.'
But then one has "eccome" (< "e come" 'and as') which is an intensifier:
Sei felice? Eccome!
'Are you happy? Very much!'
It may also be turned into a question: "eccome no?" 'how could it be
otherwise?', which retains much of the original comparative meaning.
Best
Pier Marco
Il giorno lun 12 apr 2021 alle ore 11:10 Frans Plank <
frans.plank at uni-konstanz.de> ha scritto:
>
>
>
>
> Und wie, Guillaume! (Which is German.)
>
> Frans
>
>
>
> Le 12/04/2021 à 00:35, David Gil a écrit :
>
> Thanks to those who have responded to my query so far, either to me
> personally or on the list.
>
> I'd like to clarify what I had in mind by "elided" or "incomplete". I am
> using these terms grammatically / semantically, to express the intuition
> that there's something missing after the intensifier, given that forms such
> as Papuan Malay *sampe* and (Australian) English *as* usually occur in
> construction with another, following expression (or "complement").
>
> I was not implying that the construction in question should "sound
> incomplete" (to use Ilana's words below). But it's interesting that she
> characterizes the Australian English *as* construction as being
> associated with a "particular intonation", since the same is true also for
> the Papuan Malay construction with *sampe*. Though the specifics of the
> intonation contour seem to differ (in Papuan Malay, the peak of the contour
> falls on the preceding word, while the intensifier *sampe* is associated
> with low pitch, sounding like an afterthought).
>
> David
>
>
> On 12/04/2021 00:58, Ilana Mushin wrote:
>
> I can also confirm ‘sweet as’ in Australian English. I’ve seen it on
> advertising billboards. I think the construction ‘X as’ can be somewhat
> productive - eg I’ve certainly heard ‘dumb as’. There is a particular
> intonation that goes with the construction - the ‘as’ is lengthened and
> has a rise-fall contour so it doesn’t sound incomplete (this is
> impressionistic - someone may have a better idea of the prosody than me).
>
> Ilana
>
> Associate Professor Ilana Mushin
>
> Reader in Linguistics
>
> President, Australian Linguistic Society
>
>
>
> [image:
> /var/folders/lv/m77kqy0n4x1_rcd3pk0j2n900000gq/T/com.microsoft.Outlook/WebArchiveCopyPasteTempFiles/il.pb.png]
> Co-Editor, *Interactional Linguistics* (https://benjamins.com/catalog/il)
>
>
>
> School of Languages and Cultures
>
> University of Queensland
>
> St Lucia, QLD 4072.
>
> Ph: (07) 3365 6810
>
>
>
> CRICOS Provider No: 00025B
>
>
>
> *I acknowledge the Jagera and Turrbal peoples on whose land I live and
> work. Their sovereignty was never ceded.*
>
> On 12 Apr 2021, at 5:27 am, David Gil <gil at shh.mpg.de> <gil at shh.mpg.de>
> wrote:
>
>
>
> Dear all,
>
>
> I'm interested in exploring the properties and geographical distribution
> of a novel (well, to me at least) construction type which might be termed
> "Elided Intensification'. I'll explain with an example. In Papuan
> Malay, property-denoting and some other words may be intensified by the
> addition of *sampe*, a word whose other, more basic functions, include
> 'arrive' and 'until', e.g.
>
>
>
> (1) Enak sampe
>
> nice SAMPE
>
> 'Very nice.'
>
>
>
> My informal "interpretation" of this construction is that it involves, or
> at least originated in, some kind of understood expression such as "nice
> arriving (at complete fulfillment)", or "nice until (completion)". As
> Papuan Malay is largely head-initial, it kind of feels like something is
> missing after the word *sampe*. (In Malay/Indonesian, this construction
> seems to be restricted geographically to the north coast of New Guinea and
> possibly also Northern Maluku; elsewhere it is absent.)
>
>
>
> So far, I am familiar with two other potential cases of Elided
> Intensification. The first is from Ambel, an Austronesian language
> spoken in the Raja Ampat archipelago of the northwest coast of New Guinea,
> in a region where Papuan Malay is also spoken. As described by Arnold
> (2018:145, pers comm), *aya* 'until' is used in a construction closely
> resembling that in (1):
>
>
>
> (2) Anlómo aya
>
> bleed.3SG.INAN AYA
>
> ‘It bled a lot.’
>
>
>
> Arnold, Laura. 2018. *A Grammar of Ambel, An Austronesian Language of
> West New Guinea*. PhD Dissertation. Edinburgh: University of Edinburgh.
>
>
>
> The second example, which I just came across, and which prompted this
> query, is Australian English. In the Wikipedia entry for Australian
> English, in a paragraph which deals with the infensification of adjectives,
> the following rather tantalizing passage occurs:
>
>
>
> "In informal speech, incomplete comparisons are sometimes used, such as
> "sweet as" (as in "That car is sweet as.")."
>
>
>
> So here it's comparative 'as' rather than 'arrive'/'until' that comes
> after the word being intensified, but still, all these cases seem to
> involve intensification with the elision of some kind of argument
> associated with the property word and denoting an extreme extent of the
> property in question.
>
>
>
> My questions:
>
>
>
> 1. Could speakers of Australian English please confirm the existence of
> this construction, and comment on it. Does it occur in other varieties
> of English? (It was certainly completely new to me!)
>
>
>
> 2. Is anybody familiar with possible cases of Elided Intensification in
> other languages, in Australia, New Guinea or elsewhere? On the flimsy
> basis of three examples, it looks like an Australian / New Guinea areal
> feature: is this the case? For the Australia / New Guinea region I'd
> also appreciate negative data, of the form "no, my language definitely
> doesn't do this".
>
>
>
> 3. Any further comments and suggestions ...
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
>
>
> David
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> David Gil
>
> Senior Scientist (Associate)
> Department of Linguistic and Cultural Evolution
> Max Planck Institute for the Science of Human History
> Kahlaische Strasse 10, 07745 Jena, Germany
>
> Email: gil at shh.mpg.de
> Mobile Phone (Israel): +972-526117713
> Mobile Phone (Indonesia): +62-81344082091
>
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> --
> David Gil
>
> Senior Scientist (Associate)
> Department of Linguistic and Cultural Evolution
> Max Planck Institute for the Science of Human History
> Kahlaische Strasse 10, 07745 Jena, Germany
>
> Email: gil at shh.mpg.de
> Mobile Phone (Israel): +972-526117713
> Mobile Phone (Indonesia): +62-81344082091
>
>
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--
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