[Lingtyp] Lingtyp Digest, Vol 90, Issue 14

Sat Mar 12 17:36:03 UTC 2022

Dear Jorge,

There’s a famous bit about this—funny although quite spurious. Quoting from the Wikipedia article about the philosopher Sidney Morgenbesser:

'According to one anecdote, when J. L. Austin<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/J._L._Austin> claimed that, although a double negative<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double_negative> often implies a positive meaning (eg. "he is not unlike his sister"), there is no language in which a double positive<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pleonasm> implies a negative, Morgenbesser retorted: "Yeah, yeah.”’

Ironically, it’s often quoted (attributed to various people) as a philosopher’s joke at the expense of linguists. But of course, the joke is really on them, especially since the fall guy was not only a philosopher, but, arguably, one of the founders of pragmatics, which explains such things in far more plausible terms! ;)

Tony

On Mar 12, 2022, at 11:00 AM, lingtyp-request at listserv.linguistlist.org<mailto:lingtyp-request at listserv.linguistlist.org> wrote:

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Today's Topics:

  1. Reduplication for negation marking (Jorge Rosés Labrada)
  2. Re: Reduplication for negation marking (Gilles Authier)

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Message: 1
Date: Sat, 12 Mar 2022 11:00:49 -0500
From: Jorge Rosés Labrada <jrosesla at ualberta.ca>
To: etnolinguistica at googlegroups.com,  "list, typology"
<lingtyp at listserv.linguistlist.org>
Subject: [Lingtyp] Reduplication for negation marking
Message-ID:
<CAA6kzGvMHGih_bghEEmYKAgokC4Uy1DZ-Ywh3ouVfgtPZ0+9-Q at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"

Estimad at s, prezad at s, dear everyone,

Is any of you familiar with a language where negation (of main clauses but
I'll take any type of negation) is marked via reduplication? Dahl (1979:81)
says this is a "marginal" type of negation marking and mentions only one
language (Tabasaran, Nakh-Daghestanian) where a subset of verbs
(trisyllabic and with a preverb) mark negation via reduplication—in this
case, reportedly of the second syllable—and Inkelas (2012: 357) says that
reduplication in one "of the functions that seem rarely, if ever, to be
reduplicative in form."

Any suggestions would be much appreciated!

Best,
Jorge

References:
Dahl, Östen. 1979. “Typology of Sentence Negation.” *Linguistics* 17 (1–2):
79–106. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fdoi.org%2F10.1515%2Fling.1979.17.1-2.79&data=04%7C01%7C%7C1427b4fb40f7418dec0208da044ac4e1%7C31d7e2a5bdd8414e9e97bea998ebdfe1%7C0%7C0%7C637827016425321801%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=pf0chGuFwjypPTxzJYE5jSUAJ5OOWNvSU9ZGXLHl35E%3D&reserved=0.
Inkelas, Sharon. 2012. “Reduplication.” In *The Morphology and Phonology of
Exponence*, edited by Jochen Trommer, 355–79. Oxford: Oxford University
Press. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fdoi.org%2F10.1093%2Facprof%3Aoso%2F9780199573721.003.0011&data=04%7C01%7C%7C1427b4fb40f7418dec0208da044ac4e1%7C31d7e2a5bdd8414e9e97bea998ebdfe1%7C0%7C0%7C637827016425321801%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=vd9DNcPjsRPxMUgKqrYZFZjfcd%2Bq7GUx%2FdbNvhLHtLg%3D&reserved=0.
-------------
Jorge Emilio Rosés Labrada (He, him, his
<https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.su.ualberta.ca%2Fservices%2Fthelanding%2Flearn%2Fpronouns%2F&data=04%7C01%7C%7C1427b4fb40f7418dec0208da044ac4e1%7C31d7e2a5bdd8414e9e97bea998ebdfe1%7C0%7C0%7C637827016425321801%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=w9Oe0qIaVPus9i%2FJhWSKZTS68y62BVPiIA3f7JzdIBQ%3D&reserved=0>)
Assistant Professor, Indigenous Language Sustainability

4-22 Assiniboia Hall
Department of Linguistics, University of Alberta
Tel: (+1) 780-492-5698
Email: jrosesla at ualberta.ca

*The University of Alberta acknowledges that we are located on Treaty 6
territory, **and respects the history, languages, and cultures of the First
Nations, Métis, Inuit, *
*and all First Peoples of Canada, whose presence continues to enrich our
institution.*
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Message: 2
Date: Sat, 12 Mar 2022 17:55:06 +0100
From: Gilles Authier <gilles.authier at gmail.com>
To: Jorge Rosés Labrada <jrosesla at ualberta.ca>
Cc: etnolinguistica at googlegroups.com,  "list, typology"
<lingtyp at listserv.linguistlist.org>
Subject: Re: [Lingtyp] Reduplication for negation marking
Message-ID:
<CAFcLiN=po6KJHHW7chbVjq3FNAMqd8kOr6ms9TDgEQ2sz5ghcg at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"

Dear Jorge,

Dahl's reference needs to be nuanced using his first-hand source, most
likely Magometov' grammar (1965, p 208) (*alakuz* 'to smear' > neg *alalakuz,
*etc). Here an analogical process yielded apparent reduplication of the
preverb (the negation prefix has many allomorphs, one of which ends up
matching one of the preverbs).
More to your point are the neighbouring (also East Caucasian but but not
closely related) Dargwa dialects), where the *root *appears duplicated
before the original negative prefixed form, in particular Kubachi, after
the negation prefix underwent attrition, also described by Magometov
(1963): *ba:q'ij* 'to do', neg. *ba:q'a:q'ij (< **b-a:q'-(a)-a:q'-ij *
gender-do.PF-(NEG)-do.pf-INF*)*

This is very probably a micro-areal feature.
GA

On Sat, Mar 12, 2022 at 5:01 PM Jorge Rosés Labrada <jrosesla at ualberta.ca>
wrote:

Estimad at s, prezad at s, dear everyone,

Is any of you familiar with a language where negation (of main clauses but
I'll take any type of negation) is marked via reduplication? Dahl (1979:81)
says this is a "marginal" type of negation marking and mentions only one
language (Tabasaran, Nakh-Daghestanian) where a subset of verbs
(trisyllabic and with a preverb) mark negation via reduplication—in this
case, reportedly of the second syllable—and Inkelas (2012: 357) says that
reduplication in one "of the functions that seem rarely, if ever, to be
reduplicative in form."

Any suggestions would be much appreciated!

Best,
Jorge

References:
Dahl, Östen. 1979. “Typology of Sentence Negation.” *Linguistics* 17
(1–2): 79–106. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fdoi.org%2F10.1515%2Fling.1979.17.1-2.79&data=04%7C01%7C%7C1427b4fb40f7418dec0208da044ac4e1%7C31d7e2a5bdd8414e9e97bea998ebdfe1%7C0%7C0%7C637827016425321801%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=pf0chGuFwjypPTxzJYE5jSUAJ5OOWNvSU9ZGXLHl35E%3D&reserved=0.
Inkelas, Sharon. 2012. “Reduplication.” In *The Morphology and Phonology
of Exponence*, edited by Jochen Trommer, 355–79. Oxford: Oxford
University Press.
https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fdoi.org%2F10.1093%2Facprof%3Aoso%2F9780199573721.003.0011&data=04%7C01%7C%7C1427b4fb40f7418dec0208da044ac4e1%7C31d7e2a5bdd8414e9e97bea998ebdfe1%7C0%7C0%7C637827016425321801%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=vd9DNcPjsRPxMUgKqrYZFZjfcd%2Bq7GUx%2FdbNvhLHtLg%3D&reserved=0.
-------------
Jorge Emilio Rosés Labrada (He, him, his
<https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.su.ualberta.ca%2Fservices%2Fthelanding%2Flearn%2Fpronouns%2F&data=04%7C01%7C%7C1427b4fb40f7418dec0208da044ac4e1%7C31d7e2a5bdd8414e9e97bea998ebdfe1%7C0%7C0%7C637827016425321801%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=w9Oe0qIaVPus9i%2FJhWSKZTS68y62BVPiIA3f7JzdIBQ%3D&reserved=0>)
Assistant Professor, Indigenous Language Sustainability

4-22 Assiniboia Hall
Department of Linguistics, University of Alberta
Tel: (+1) 780-492-5698
Email: jrosesla at ualberta.ca

*The University of Alberta acknowledges that we are located on Treaty 6
territory, **and respects the history, languages, and cultures of the
First Nations, Métis, Inuit, *
*and all First Peoples of Canada, whose presence continues to enrich our
institution.*
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End of Lingtyp Digest, Vol 90, Issue 14
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