[Lingtyp] small language families and typological rarities
Iker Salaberri
ikersalaberri at gmail.com
Mon Nov 20 12:36:38 UTC 2023
Dear Peter,
You may want to check out the first chapter, "Language isolates and their
history", by Lyle Campbell in the book (2017) *Language isolates* edited by
himself (
https://www.routledge.com/Language-Isolates/Campbell/p/book/9780367870959),
where the author concludes that "[t]here is nothing unusual about isolates".
In any case, if I understand correctly, the lack of unusual traits mostly
refers to the diachrony of isolates, that is to say, how they change over
time, how they diversify into dialects and eventually become small language
families, etc.
Best,
Iker
--
From: Lingtyp <lingtyp-bounces at listserv.linguistlist.org> on behalf of
Peter Arkadiev <peterarkadiev at yandex.ru>
Date: Monday, November 20, 2023 at 11:54
To: Linguistic Typology <lingtyp at listserv.linguistlist.org>
Subject: [Lingtyp] small language families and typological rarities
Dear typologists,
I vaguely recall having read or heard that it has been claimed that small
language families and language isolates have a greater probability of
possessing typologically unusual and rare features, however, I cannot
locate any references discussing this issue (the two volumes of Rara et
Rarissima published in 2010 do not, as far as I can tell). I would be
grateful for any references that either espouse such a claim or explicitly
disconfirm it.
Thanks in advance!
Peter
--
Peter Arkadiev, PhD Habil.
https://peterarkadiev.github.io/
On Mon, 20 Nov 2023 at 13:02, <lingtyp-request at listserv.linguistlist.org>
wrote:
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> Today's Topics:
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> 1. small language families and typological rarities (Peter Arkadiev)
> 2. Re: small language families and typological rarities
> (Juergen Bohnemeyer)
> 3. Re: small language families and typological rarities (Ian Joo)
> 4. Re: small language families and typological rarities
> (Peter Arkadiev)
> 5. Re: small language families and typological rarities
> (Christian Lehmann)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2023 13:54:46 +0300
> From: Peter Arkadiev <peterarkadiev at yandex.ru>
> To: Linguistic Typology <lingtyp at listserv.linguistlist.org>
> Subject: [Lingtyp] small language families and typological rarities
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> Message: 2
> Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2023 11:00:45 +0000
> From: Juergen Bohnemeyer <jb77 at buffalo.edu>
> To: Peter Arkadiev <peterarkadiev at yandex.ru>, Linguistic Typology
> <lingtyp at listserv.linguistlist.org>
> Subject: Re: [Lingtyp] small language families and typological
> rarities
> Message-ID:
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>
> Dear Peter ? I think this is at least indirectly addressed in the Skirg?rd
> et al. (2023) release article of Grambank:
>
> https://www.science.org/doi/10.1126/sciadv.adg6175
>
> One of the things explored in there is the correlation between
> endangerment and typological rarity/uniqueness.
>
> Best ? Juergen
>
>
> Juergen Bohnemeyer (He/Him)
> Professor, Department of Linguistics
> University at Buffalo
>
> Office: 642 Baldy Hall, UB North Campus
> Mailing address: 609 Baldy Hall, Buffalo, NY 14260
> Phone: (716) 645 0127
> Fax: (716) 645 3825
> Email: jb77 at buffalo.edu<mailto:jb77 at buffalo.edu>
> Web: http://www.acsu.buffalo.edu/~jb77/
>
> Office hours Tu/Th 3:30-4:30pm in 642 Baldy or via Zoom (Meeting ID 585
> 520 2411; Passcode Hoorheh)
>
> There?s A Crack In Everything - That?s How The Light Gets In
> (Leonard Cohen)
> --
>
>
> From: Lingtyp <lingtyp-bounces at listserv.linguistlist.org> on behalf of
> Peter Arkadiev <peterarkadiev at yandex.ru>
> Date: Monday, November 20, 2023 at 11:54
> To: Linguistic Typology <lingtyp at listserv.linguistlist.org>
> Subject: [Lingtyp] small language families and typological rarities
> Dear typologists,
>
> I vaguely recall having read or heard that it has been claimed that small
> language families and language isolates have a greater probability of
> possessing typologically unusual and rare features, however, I cannot
> locate any references discussing this issue (the two volumes of Rara et
> Rarissima published in 2010 do not, as far as I can tell). I would be
> grateful for any references that either espouse such a claim or explicitly
> disconfirm it.
>
> Thanks in advance!
>
> Peter
>
> --
> Peter Arkadiev, PhD Habil.
> https://peterarkadiev.github.io/
>
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2023 20:07:02 +0900
> From: Ian Joo <ian_joo at nucba.ac.jp>
> To: "<LINGTYP at LISTSERV.LINGUISTLIST.ORG>"
> <lingtyp at listserv.linguistlist.org>
> Subject: Re: [Lingtyp] small language families and typological
> rarities
> Message-ID: <E7E05455-F9BA-4957-B0C5-E8D1CC73DCEA at nucba.ac.jp>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> Dear Peter,
>
> I?m not aware of the source you have in mind, but maybe such statement can
> be simply logically inferred?
> A feature being ?typologically rare? means fewer lects have it.
> A family being smaller or isolate means it has fewer lects (minimally one).
> Also, features are commonly shared by the lects of the same family, by the
> virtue of common heritage.
> So smaller family = smaller sibling lects to share inherited features with
> = more likely to have ?rare? features.
> For example, if all Indo-European lects suddenly disappeared except for
> English, English would be one of the very few lects with typically
> Indo-European traits (along with some other lects that happen to share them
> due to contact or coincidence).
>
> From Japan,
> Ian
>
> - - - - -
> JOO, IAN ???
> Lecturer ??
> Faculty of International Studies ????
> Nagoya University of Commerce and Business ???????
> Nisshin, Aichi, Japan ??????
> https://ianjoo.github.io
> - - - - -
>
> > 20.11.2023 19:55, Peter Arkadiev <peterarkadiev at yandex.ru> ??:
> >
> > ?
> > Dear typologists,
> >
> > I vaguely recall having read or heard that it has been claimed that
> small language families and language isolates have a greater probability of
> possessing typologically unusual and rare features, however, I cannot
> locate any references discussing this issue (the two volumes of Rara et
> Rarissima published in 2010 do not, as far as I can tell). I would be
> grateful for any references that either espouse such a claim or explicitly
> disconfirm it.
> >
> > Thanks in advance!
> >
> > Peter
> >
> > --
> > Peter Arkadiev, PhD Habil.
> > https://peterarkadiev.github.io/
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Lingtyp mailing list
> > Lingtyp at listserv.linguistlist.org
> > https://listserv.linguistlist.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/lingtyp
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> Message: 4
> Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2023 14:20:43 +0300
> From: Peter Arkadiev <peterarkadiev at yandex.ru>
> To: Ian Joo <ian_joo at nucba.ac.jp>, "\""
> <lingtyp at listserv.linguistlist.org>
> Subject: Re: [Lingtyp] small language families and typological
> rarities
> Message-ID: <152471700479100 at mail.yandex.ru>
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> ------------------------------
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> Message: 5
> Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2023 11:49:55 +0000
> From: Christian Lehmann <christian.lehmann at uni-erfurt.de>
> To: lingtyp at listserv.linguistlist.org
> Subject: Re: [Lingtyp] small language families and typological
> rarities
> Message-ID: <7fa3a12f-584a-4a1d-9fc6-fc15aca43f5a at uni-erfurt.de>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed"
>
> It is, at any rate, claimed here:
>
>
> https://www.spektrum.de/news/isolierte-sprachen-die-geheimnisse-der-ueberlebenden/2184438?utm_source=pocket-newtab-de-de
>
> (for what it may be worth ...).
>
> Cheers, Christian
>
> --
>
> Prof. em. Dr. Christian Lehmann
> Rudolfstr. 4
> 99092 Erfurt
> Deutschland
>
> Tel.: +49/361/2113417
> E-Post: christianw_lehmann at arcor.de
> Web: https://www.christianlehmann.eu
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