LL-L: "Morphology" LOWLANDS-L, 16.NOV.1999 (08) [E]

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From: Roger P. G. Thijs [roger.thijs at village.uunet.be]
Subject:  LL-L: "Limburgish" LOWLANDS-L, 14.NOV.1999 (01) [D/E]

> From: Roger P. G. Thijs [roger.thijs at village.uunet.be]
> Subject: Limburgish: Past participle without ge-prefix
> H.H.A. van de Wijngaard, Blève, kómme, krèje, vónge, woeëde i kaat braat,
> Het voltooid deelwoord van zes werkwoorden met perfectieve betekenis in de
> Limburgse dialecten., p. 79-90 in the "Jaarboek 1999".

> From: R. F. Hahn [sassisch at yahoo.com]
> Subject: Limburgish
> Limburgish / Low Saxon
> Hi-e ees tezénnes __bléve__ / He is bie em (tohuus') bleven.
> Hi-e hèt énne kaa __krége__ / He hett 'n Verkölen kregen (~ He hett sick
'n Verkölen
> upsackt ~ He hett sick wat upsackt)
> Ich heb main pen en menne boek __vonne__ / Ick heff mien Penn un mien Book
funnen.
> Eest er zik __wjonne__?/ Is he krank/seek/süük worren?
> Ich heb oech da mèt__brouch__ (also: mèt_ge_braach) / Ick heff ju dat
mitbröcht.

I forgot "komen" in my list:
Ich ben herres __koome__ (Dutch: ik ben naar hier toe gekomen)

> Doesn't omission of the past participle prefix _ge-_ also occur in some
Upper
> German dialects?

In the West of the Ripuarian area: Heinsberg (Germany), close to Limburg
(Be aware the prefix in Ripuarian is "je-")
Quoting from: L. Gillessen, Mundart im Heinsberger Land, 410 pp., 1999, DM
30 at the Kreisverwaltung, Valkenburger Str. 45, D 52525 Heinsberg.:
quoting from pp. 345-365 Konjugationstabelle:

The normal forms
äete (essen) jä.ete
bäänge (binden) jeboonge
bitte (beißen), jebi.ete

Verbs without "j(e)-" prefix (excluding verbs that start with "be-" or
"ver-"):
bliive (bleiben), bli.eve
bräänge (bringen) brooch
väänge (finden), voonge
vrä.ete (fressen), vrä.ete
koome (kommen), koome
krije (kriegen) kri.eje

So they found one more in Heinsberg, they clearly "fress" in a way their
action is already to be considered terminated while they are doing it.

For East Ripuarian: Kölsch (Cologne), quoting from Leson, Kölsch von A bis
Z, Band I,
blieve, jeblevve
brenge, jebraat
finge is listed without it's p.p.
(Fresse is only listed as plural from Freß, Maul)
(kommen is not listed, probably not very different from German)
krijje, jekräch
I guess it disappears allready at a short distance East from the Limburgian
area.

Similarely, for Brabant, West of the Limburgian area, for Leuven (quoting
from Wellekens, Diksjonêr van 't Leives, 1994, 507 pp.)
bloëve, gebleive
bringe, gebrocht
vinge, gevonge
koume, gekoume
kroëge, gekreige
So they have the ge- prefix for our verbs.

But the South:
In Lëtzebuergesch we find them back (quoting from the "Lëtzebuerger
Dixionär"):
bleiwen, bliwwen
bréngen, bruecht
fannen, fond
kommen, komm
kreien, kritt

Regards,
Roger

----------

From: R. F. Hahn [sassisch at yahoo.com]
Subject:  Morphology

Roger wrote:

> I forgot "komen" in my list:
> Ich ben herres __koome__ (Dutch: ik ben naar hier toe gekomen)

Low Saxon (Low German), North Saxon"
Ick bün na(ar) hier (to) kamen (~ komen). ~
Ick bün hier her kamen (~ komen).

Regards,

Reinhard/Ron

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