LL-L: "Language varieties" LOWLANDS-L, 26.JUN.2001 (03) [D/E]

[Lowlands-L]

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 L O W L A N D S - L * 26.JUN.2001 (03) * ISSN 189-5582 * LCSN 96-4226
 Web Site: <http://www.geocities.com/sassisch/rhahn/lowlands/>
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 A=Afrikaans, Ap=Appalachean, D=Dutch, E=English, F=Frisian, L=Limburgish
 LS=Low Saxon (Low German), S=Scots, Sh=Shetlandic, Z=Zeelandic (Zeeuws)
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From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
Subject: Language varieties

"Mathieu. van Woerkom" <Mathieu.vanWoerkom at student.kun.nl> wrote today under
"Pronouns":

<...>

> About the low-saxon dialect of Urk I can say that this is indeed true. > There is
> no polite 2nd-person, just 'jie' or 'je'. Urk is also a very isolated,
> non metropolitan and close-knit community. The village used to be on an
> island (but is now part of the Flevoland polder), and is very religious
> (and therefore very close-knit).

Thanks, Mathieu.

It is an interesting language variety, indeed.

Via your splendid web page "Nedersaksisch in Nederland"
(http://members1.chello.nl/~w.vanwoerkom/nedersaksischnl.htm, belonging to
"Taal in Nederland": http://members1.chello.nl/~w.vanwoerkom/streektaal.htm),
I found the website of the Dialectkring Urk (http://dialectkring.opurk.nl/).
I went ahead and added links to the Lowlands-L list for Low Saxon
(http://www.geocities.com/sassisch/rhahn/lowlands/links_neddersassisch.htm)
and to "Nu is de Welt platt!"
(http://www.geocities.com/sassisch/rhahn/low-saxon/plattewelt.htm), informing
the good folks that I did so.

However, now, at closer inspection of the description and language samples
provided at that site, I am no longer sure that classifying the variety as
"Low Saxon" is appropriate.  Going by the samples, I feel that the basis is
Dutch, though I may be wrong there.  The description says, ...

"Het Urker dialect is een mengdialect waarin sporen van het Westfriesch,
Amelands, Fries en Oostelijke dialecten kunnen worden gevonden. Ook zijn er
leenwoorden uit het Frans en Amsterdam (Joods) in het dialect terug te vinden.
Het Urker dialect heeft verder een nogal van het Nederlands afwijkend
klinkersysteem. Bijzonder in het Urker dialect is dat de lengte van de klinker
nog significant is. Het Urker dialect kent dan ook voor al zijn al zijn
klinkers een korte en een lange variant, die niet alleen in lengte verschillen
maar ook in betekenis."

So we are dealing with a "mixed" dialect.  Of course, all language varieties
are mixed to one degree or other, but one would assume one language to be
underlying.

I assume that Low Saxon is meant by "Oostelijke dialecten."

Debate topic: "How should this language variety be classified?"

Regards,
Reinhard/Ron

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