LL-L 'Lexicon' 2007.02.10 (03) [E/Yiddish]

[Lowlands-L List]

L O W L A N D S - L - 10 February 2007 - Volume 03

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From: "Mathias Rösel" <Mathias.Roesel at t-online.de>
Subject: LL-L 'Grammar' 2007.02.09 (08) [E]

 From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
Subject: Grammar

I'm familiar with that construction.  Admittedly, though, I've always
thought of it as Ø/ß ton 'to do' being the main verb and ÒÐ¸Ø ÑâØß got
betn("implore/pray (to) God") as a sort of noun meaning "(act of)
praying" or
"prayer" ("God-imploring"), thus something like 'to do/perform (a)
prayer(s)," more specifically 'to do ê¼×ÙàÕê tkhines (< t'inoth)", "I do the
Yiddish prayers" -- as opposed to ÑâØß ÒÐ¸Ø betn got 'to pray'.

As for davnen, I've heard tefille oysse seyn, or kadish sogn. Tefille tun
may be right, but I've not heard such an expresiion.

Got is no Yidish word. God in Yidish is eloyhim, hashem and so on.

The Yidish word betn means belly, stomach.

And then there are perhaps related constructions such as ÐÙÚ ØÕ Ð· éèò·Ñ ikh
tu a shrayb ("I do a write") 'I('ll) write it down', 'I'm making a note of
it',* as opposed to plain ÐÙÚ éèò·Ñ ikh shrayb 'I('ll) write', 'I'm
writing'.

In idischer sproch sogt men nit ikh, men sogt yakh.

Thanks for the food for thought, and ÒÕØ éÑê Gut Shabes!

git shabbes, afile mir seynen goyim

--

Mathias
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From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
Subject: Lexicon

Thanks, Mathias.  I wish I could defer to your better knowledge, but I
can't, especially when taking a cross-dialect view.

> Tefille tun may be right, but I've not heard such an expresiion.

It is quite correct and is used regularly.  I invite you to look it up, such
as in Weinreich and at www.yiddishdictionaryonline.com/.

E.g., Mendele (Nov. 24 1993):

Date: Wed Nov 24 10:01:53 1993
From: bochner at das.harvard.edu
Subject: koydesh un khol

Pe'rets Mett writes:

> Correct me if I am wrong, but my feeling is that the difference
> between koydesh and khol uses of words with otherwise similar
> meanings is rstricted to nouns, and in any event, the koydesh use is

> a word of Hebrew origin e.g. seyfer - bukh.
Well, as you've seen, in many dialects (though not yours)
leyenen/lezn is a counterexample.
Another one is is davnen/molyen zikh. "davnen" (etymology unknown,
as far as I know) is restricted to Jewish prayer. "molyen zikh" (or
"modlyen zikh"), from Slavic, is used for Christian prayer.

Curiously, according to Weinreich the loshn koydesh terms "tfile
ton" and "mispalel zayn" are not restricted.

Khaim

***

> Got is no Yidish word. God in Yidish is eloyhim, hashem and so on.

It is so a Yiddish word! It can be traced all the way to the beginning of
Yiddish writing, even though words for God tend to be avoided in "serious"
writing, and in "serious" writing, thus in elevated style, Hebrew-derived
words tend to be used. Also, because of prohibitions, one of the letters
tends to be omitted (e.g., "g_t"). Got is probably the most down-to-earth
Yiddish word for "God".

Let me limit it to a couple of examples taken from an abundant supply:

Eyli, Eyli, lama azavtani?
In fayer un flam hot men undz gebrent,
Iberal hot men undz gemakht tsu shand un shpot

Dokh optsuvendn hot undz keyner gekent
Fun dir mayn Got
Un fun dayn heylike toyre
Fun dayn gebot.

Eyli...
Tog un nakht, nor ikh trakht
Fun dir mayn Got.
Ikh hit mit moyre
Op dayn toyre un dayn gebot.

Rete mikh, oy rete mikh fun gefar
Vi a mol di oves fun beyzn gzar
Her mayn gebet un mayn geveyn

Helfn kenstu dokh nor aleyn
Shma Israel! Adonay Eloheynu
Adonay Ekhad
***
My translation:

My God, my God, why have You abandoned me?
In fire and flames have we been burnt
They shamed and mocked us everywhere

But no one could make us turn away
From You, my God
And from Your Holy Torah
From Your commandments

My god...
Day and night, all I think
Is of You, my God.
I keep with awe
Your Torah and your commandments

Save me! Oh, save me from peril
Like you once saved our fathers from a terrible lot

The only one who can help is You
Listen, Israel, our Lord is God
Our Lord is one.

***

From Holocaust literature:
Mayn tayerer Got, vifil tfiles tsu im hob ikh farshvent!
My dear God, how many prayers have I wasted on him!

Mayn Got shloft un ikh vakh iber im.
My God is sleeping, and I watch over him.

***

> In idischer sproch sogt men nit ikh, men sogt yakh.

Ikh badank zikh far di hilf. Nor ayer informatsie iz a ponem bagrentst oyf
di poylishe dialekt-grupe (elehey Varshe-Yidish "haant el yakh nit kimen"
anshtot "haynt vel ikh nit kumen").  Atsind shraybt men internatsyonal
(bazundersh inem internets) dialekt-"naytral" mit lateynishe oysyes -- /u/ =
u, /i/ = i, /aj/ = ay, /ej/ = ey, ... Ayeder shraybt ot azoy, nor men ken
alts aroysredn al-pi zayn dialekt.

Reinhard/Ron
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