LL-L "Etymology" 2007.03.29 (03) [E]

Thu Mar 29 23:58:08 UTC 2007

L O W L A N D S - L - 29 March 2007 - Volume 02

=========================================================================

From: Luc Hellinckx <luc.hellinckx at gmail.com>
Subject: LL-L "Etymology"

Dear Heather,

On Wed, 2007-03-28 at 10:10 -0700, you wrote:

What would the Flemish form be? "quebb"  "qwebb"  and would this still be c
13th century?

Yes. The Middle Dutch form would be "quebbe". At least until the 16th
century I guess. Later on, coming from the east, the final -e- started to
drop, but I don't think there has been any substantial Flemish settling in
Southern Wales that late.

Kind greetings,

Luc Hellinckx

----------

From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
Subject: Etymology

This is what the Oxford English Dictionary says about this:

***

quab, n.

[= Du. kwabbe a boggy place; cf. MLG. quabbel slime, and see QUAG.]

A marshy spot, a bog. Cf. QUABMIRE.
1617 MINSHEU Ductor, A Quabbe, or quagmire. a1656 USSHER Ann. VI. (1658) 596
Defended by the Mæotis and those quabs. 1847 HALLIWELL, Quob, a quicksand or
bog. West. 1879 G. F. JACKSON Shropsh. Word-bk., Quob, a marshy spot in a
field; a quagmire.

quabmire

Obs. exc. dial.

[f. QUAB n.2 or v., but found earlier.]

    A quagmire.
1597 BROUGHTON Ep. to Nobility Wks. 570 Oversights, which for a dry causie
bring us to quabmyres. 1841 HARTSHORNE Salop. Antiq. Gloss. 539 Quobmire, a
quagmire.

quag, n.

[Related to QUAG v.; cf. QUAB, QUAW, and see QUAGMIRE.]

    a. A marshy or boggy spot, esp. one covered with a layer of turf which
shakes or yields when walked on. Also transf. and fig.
1589 P. IVE Fortif. 16 Where you finde quicke sands, quages, and such like.
1657 HOWELL Londinop. 342 Moorfields, which in former times, was but a fenny
quagge, or moore. a1677 BARROW Serm. Wks. 1716 III. 143 The latter walk upon
a bottomless Quag into which unawares they may slump. 1784 COWPER Tiroc. 253
We keep the road, Crooked or straight, through quags or thorny dells. 1842
I. TAYLOR Anc. Christianity II. VIII. 480 Thoughtless thousands of the
people are thus beguiled into the filthiest quags of 'abominable idolatry'.
1883 BESANT All in a Garden fair I. ii. (1885) 19 There are pools in the
forest..there are marshy places and quags. 1888 Ch. Times 27 Jan. 68/3 All
who are trying to find a way out of the Vatican quag, without turning
Protestants. 1904 Daily Chron. 18 May 3/4 Her clothes were a quag of blood.

    b. attrib. and Comb., as quag-brain, -kind, -water.
1719 D'URFEY Pills (1872) II. 244 Tho' Law and Justice were of slender
growth Within his quag Brain. 1772 WALKER in Phil. Trans. LXII. 124 It was
mostly of the quag kind, which is a sort of moss covered at top with a turf
of heath and coarse aquatic grasses. a1870 D. G. ROSSETTI Poems (1870) 252,
I..fouled my feet in quag-water.

quagmire

[app. f. QUAG n. or v.1 (but evidenced a little earlier) + MIRE. Numerous
synonyms, with a first element of similar form, were in use in the 16th and
17th cents., as qua-, quab-, quad-, quake-, qual-, quave-, quawmire, which
will be found in their alphabetical places: cf. also bog-, gog- and wag-mire.
The precise relationship of these to each other is not clear: all, or most,
may be independent attempts to express the same idea (cf. etym. note to
QUAKE v.).]

    1. A piece of wet and boggy ground, too soft to sustain the weight of
men or the larger animals; a quaking bog; a fen, marsh.
1579-80 NORTH Plutarch (1676) 530 There was a certain quagmire before him,
that ran with a swift running stream. 1610 ROWLANDS Martin Mark-all 26 They
come to bogs and quagmyres, much like to them in Ireland. 1665 Surv. Aff.
Netherl. 120 [Holland is] the greatest Bogg of Europe, and Quagmire of
Christendom. 1756 C. LUCAS Ess. Waters II. 131 The quagmire being
pierced..is found no where above two feet deep. 1838 PRESCOTT Ferd. & Is.
(1846) III. xiv. 121 The excessive rains..had converted the whole country
into a mere quagmire. 1882 OUIDA Maremma I. 47 To reach the mountain crest
without sinking miserably in a quagmire.
Comb. 1611 COTGR., Mollasse,..quagmire-like.

    2. transf. and fig.

a. Anything soft, flabby, or yielding.
1635 QUARLES Embl. I. xii. (1718) 50 Thy flesh a trembling bog, a quagmire
full of humours. a1704 T. BROWN Praise Poverty Wks. 1730 I. 100 The rich are
corpulent, drown'd in foggy quagmires of fat and dropsy. 1822-34 Good's
Study Med. (ed. 4) IV. 488 The indurated patches seem, in some cases, to be
fixed upon a quagmire of offensive fluid.

    b. A position or situation from which extrication is difficult.
1775 SHERIDAN Rivals III. iv, I have followed Cupid's Jack-a-lantern, and
find myself in a quagmire at last. 1851 BRIGHT Sp., Eccl. Titles Bill 12
May, The noble Lord..is in a quagmire, and he knows it well. 1873 HAMERTON
Intell. Life V. ii. (1875) 178 Many a fine intellect has been driven into
the deep quagmire.

    Hence {sm}quagmire v., in pass. to be sunk or stuck in a quagmire; also
fig. {dag}{sm}quagmirist, one who makes a quagmire of himself. {sm}quagmiry
a., of the nature of a quagmire; boggy.
1637 WINTHROP New Eng. (1825) I. 233 A most hideous swamp, so thick with
bushes and so quagmiry [etc.]. 1655 R. YOUNGE Agst. Drunkards 4 These
drunken drones, these gut-mongers, these Quagmirists. 1701 Laconics 120 (L.)
When a reader has been quagmired in a dull heavy book. 1846 LANDOR Imag.
Conv. Wks. II. 42 A man is never quagmired till he stops.

***

By the way, "mire," too, means 'swampy ground' or 'bog'. It is an early
Scandinavian loan; cf. Old Norse *mýrr* (Icelandic *mýri*), Norwegian *myr*,
Old Swedish *myr* (Swedish *myr*), Danish *myr*. It is related to archaic
"mese" once used in southwestern England, related to Old German mios and
Middle Dutch mies, also Mies 'moss' in some "German" (Low Saxon?) dialects,
as in Miesmuschel '(blue) mussel'.

And in Northern Low Saxon, too, kweb (Quebb < *Quebbe) means 'boggy spot'.
Kwabbeln (quabbeln) means 'to shake" or 'to quake' said of soft substances,
such as fat, jelly, bog, etc., and the adjectival-adverbial relative is
kwabbelig (quabbelig).  (Clearly, the /-l-/ is that old frequentive marker
again.)

Regards,
Reinhard/Ron
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://listserv.linguistlist.org/pipermail/lowlands-l/attachments/20070329/c86a54e7/attachment.htm>