LL-L "Language politics" 2008.01.02 (03) [E]

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 A=Afrikaans Ap=Appalachian B=Brabantish D=Dutch E=English F=Frisian
 L=Limburgish LS=Lowlands Saxon (Low German) N=Northumbrian
 S=Scots Sh=Shetlandic V=(West) Flemish Z=Zeelandic (Zeeuws)

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L O W L A N D S - L  -  01 January 2008 - Volume 03
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From: Marcus Buck <list at marcusbuck.org>
Subject: LL-L "Language varieties" 2008.01.02 (02) [E]

> From: Ed Alexander <edsells at cogeco.ca <mailto:edsells at cogeco.ca>>
> Subject: LL-L "Language attitudes" 2008.01.02 (01) [E]
>
> At 09:24 AM 02/01/2008 -0800, Helge wrote:
>
> >I agree in with you about the relationship between the Nazies and Low
> >Saxon. etc
>
> I watched Das Boot once again on TV the other night, and am finding that I
> am able to follow the German dialogue much better and need the sub titles
> less and less.  One thing I noted this time was one sailor greeting the
> others with a Moin, moin, but then going on to speak in HG.  Not that I
> would know.  While I can speak and understand "radio HG" passably well,
> dialects are much more difficult for me.  I can read most of the lowlands
> languages pretty well, but comprehension beyond that is pretty bad for
> me.  Those of you who can distinguish between "German" dialects, could you
> help me here?  Are regional dialects represented in this film?  I would
> have suspected a lot of Platt among sailors, but I guess that could be as
> wrong as expecting American sailors in war films to all speak local port
> accents.  My final question would be, then, if the moin, moin guy goes on
> to speak in HG, then perhaps the Nazi policy has survived the war.
>
Non-standard language is not used in the military than for private talk
under the soldiers (if they all know the language). And of course, "Das
Boot" is a movie and movies don't depict the reality. In a movie
non-standard language is only used, if the plot demands it.
Moin moin stems from Northern German dialect, but is too part of
Northern German colloquial speech. So the moin moin does not indicate
dialect use in the film.
Among sailors (btw, do submariners [or whatever the term for
U-Boot-Fahrer may be] count for sailors?) there was much use of Platt in
that time, but more in civil seafaring, like fishermen and coastal and
inland trade (in de Schipperee). You ask whether the Nazi policy has
survived the war: There is no special Nazi policy about Low Saxon. There
was no official use before, there was no official use after. The
attitude towards Low Saxon was consistent from the times in the 17th
century when official use of Low Saxon was finally abolished until
today. The European Charter for Regional or Minority Languages (from
1994 on) was the first step for real language recognition in three
hundred years. And had not much effect on the attitude towards the
language. The government has only granted rights with no costs involved
and even of those most are not fulfilled according to the monitoring
reports.
So, in this case the Nazis are not to blame.

Marcus Buck

•

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