LL-L "Language use" 2008.11.20 (03) [E/LS]

[Lowlands-L List]

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L O W L A N D S - L - 20 November 2008 - Volume 03
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From: Arend Victorie <victorie.a at home.nl>
Subject: LL-L "Language use" 2008.11.20 (02) [D/E]

Moi Luc en Jenny,

Luc ie schreven,

Simple, just answer in French. Not too many Northerners speak (good)
French...and if they do, there's a fair chance they may be ashamed of their
own accent.

Mmm...guess I'm wrong: a bashful Dutchman? Is that a contradictio in
terminis? Or an oxymoron? *s*

Naah...quite frankly: If you'd answer in French, I'm quite sure most would
keep on chattering in English. Yes folks, this is how "minor" languages
actually commit suicide...truth can be stranger than fiction. And true it
is; here in Brussels, many French speakers would rather switch to English
when addressing a Fleming (even if they could get their act together in
Dutch), than using Dutch. This is what "status" and "losing face" is all
about.

On a more positive note, one could also say that using a third language,
both speakers avoid having to bow. Using a third language they are both on
foreign ground. The problem is: If I was raised in the Randstad, totally
accustomed to standard Dutch, and I know that the one that I'm talking to
primarily speaks dialect, what can we do? The dialect speaker could try to
find the middle way, using some sort of "Missingsch", one would say in
German. However, what can the Randstad-guy do? I'm quite sure most cannot
immediately change the register and swap to artificial semi-dialect. So if
he keeps on talking standard, while at the same time the other guy is doing
his best to make himself understood, there'd be a significant advantage for
the Randstedeling. Maybe that's why unarming and using English can also be
viewed like some sort of "necessary evil".

Jenny ie schreven,

In het taleninstituut waar ik werk, hoor ik dezelfde verhalen, vooral van
Engelstaligen die Nederlands leren bij ons. Een 'overlevingszin' die we hen
leren te gebruiken is: "Ik versta geen Engels". Soms helpt dat…

@Diederik: ik schaam me bijna om Nederlander te zijn als ik jouw verhaal
lees, ik ben blij dat ik ver van Amsterdam woon. Maar om je enigszins te
troosten: als ik in Amsterdam kom en Nederlands praat in een café,
restaurant of winkel, word ook ik raar aangekeken en mijn Brabantse/Bossche
accent is helemaal niet sterk. Ik krijg dan altijd de neiging om het te
overdrijven en er wel Brabants tussendoor te gooien. De hoofdstedelingen
denken toch al dat wij 'reserve'-Belgen zijn (samen met de Limburgers).

Der bint en blieft altied mèensen die keuning wult speulen. Ok ik kome dat
alle dagen tegen in mien wark in Almere. Ik heb een Dreinse tongval en dat
is goed te hèuren in mien Nederlaandse taal. (Een Drent slikt hiel veule
woorden in.) En as zij mij daor op wiest en der een flauw grapie aover
maakt, dan doe dan mangs dat, waor as ie de neiging naor hebt Jenny. Ik gooi
dan mien allerbeste Dreins der tussendeur en laot ze dan mar raoden wa'k
zegge. As 't mut dan revel ik ze riegelrecht de verlègenheid in. En vèur
hèur eigen goederdeugt dreit ze dan wel bij. Zij hebt dan de muuilijkhèden
ik niet, zij verstaot mij niet. De mèensen in 't noorden, oosten en 't
zuuden van 't laand bint in 't verlèden altied enegerd en daor haw nog nog
altieden de naoweën van. Mar ja daor he'k 't al zo vake aover ehad daor
gao'k mij now niet meer aover uutweiden. Allewel, der bint altied nog meer
mèensen in 't westen die oe wel neemt zo daj bint en oe wel in de  wèerde
laot..

Goodgaon,

Arend Victorie, Hoogeveen Drenthe.
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From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
Subject: Language use

Ha! Here's another idea: If you did not grow up in the Randstad but spend
time there and are frustrated with people answering in English, go out
wearing a lapel pin that says something like the following:

for Achterhoeks: "Ig praot wal Hollaands, moar met 'n moier accent dan gij."

for Antwerpens: "Ikke spreek wel Nederlands, mòr mè nê moier accent dan ga."

for Brussels: "Ik praat wel Nederlands, maar met nen moier accent dan gaa."

for Drents: "Ik sprèek wel Ollaands, maor met n mooier accent dan ie."

for Flemish: "Ik klap wel Nederlands, maar mit een pleizantere accent dan
gij."

for Gronings: "Ik praot wel Hollaands, moar mit n moier accent dan doe."

for Haags: "Ik praat wel Nedeâhrlands, maar met un moieâhr accent dan jè."

For Twents: "Ik spreke wa Hollaands, moar met nen moier accent dan doe."


for Zealandic: "k Spreêk wel Ollans, maer mee eên schoôner accent dan jie."

And so forth ...



Or general: "Ik spreek wel Nederlands, maar met een moier accent dan jij."

If any of this is correct, that is.


Change/correct any of the above as needed, but I insist on getting a share
of the profits should any of you make any with this idea.

Let's use our Diederik as the guinea pig to see if he gets beaten up in
Amsterdam when he wears his pin!

Regards,
Reinhard/Ron
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