LL-L "Idiomatica" 2009.08.21 (01) [DE-EN-NDS-NL]

Sun Aug 21 23:12:24 UTC 2011

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 L O W L A N D S - L - 21 August 2011 - Volume 01
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From: Mike Morgan mwmbombay at gmail.com
Subject: LL-L "Idiomatica" 2009.08.20 (02) [EN]

Okay, while we are talking about attachment, and holding someone in
affection, here is a view form (old) South Asia:

In Sanskrit, non-sexual love is *sneha* (the sexual, as we are all is *kama*,
as in Kama-sutra). *Sneha* has a wide range of "meanings", including not
only *attachment, tenderness, fondness, affection, love* but also:
stickiness, adhesiveness; smoothness; blandness; oil, grease, any fatty
substance; etc

The verb (root: स्निह् snih-) takes a locative argument for the person or
thing that is loved or liked, and also has a range usages: to love, to like,
to be attached to, pleased with, kind to, be sticky, be adhesive, be smooth,
be bland

In otehr words, "I'm stuck on you"... but, the image/feeling I have is that
this is a moist, sticky, even oily kind of attachment...  (maybe influenced
by the high humidity and mositure levels of rainy season, which we are right
now in the midst of)

ALSO:

Intriguingly, the causative can mean not only to cause to love (as expected)
but also to dissolve, destroy, kill.
Modern Hindi *pyār* love (in the romantic but not sexual sense) comes from *
priyakāra* literally "doing a kindness".
Nepali *māyā* (which Turner defines as sexual love, but which clearly in
MODERN Nepali is just romantic love) is also the word for "illusion, fraud,
deceit" (as in the Buddhist concept that all the wrold is *māyā*

References:

VS Apte's Practical Sanskrit-English DIctionary accessible at:
http://dsal.uchicago.edu/cgi-bin/philologic/contextualize.pl?p.6.apte.1428893

AA Macdonell's Practical Sanskrit Dictionary accessible at:
http://dsal.uchicago.edu/cgi-bin/romadict.pl?table=macdonell&page=182&display=simple

RL Turner's Comparative Dictionary of the Indo-Aryan Languages accessible
at:
http://dsal.uchicago.edu/cgi-bin/philologic/getobject.pl?c.3:1:501.soas

mwm || *U* C > || mike || мика  || माईक || マイク || மாய்க் (aka Dr Michael W
Morgan)
Senior Consultant
BA in Applied Sign Language Studies (BAASLS)
इन्दिरा गांधी राष्ट्रीय मुक्त विश्वविद्यालय | Indira Gandhi National Open
University, New Delhi, India
*"If one has no affection for a person or a system, one should feel free to
give the fullest expression to his disaffection so long as he does not
contemplate, promote, or incite violence." (MKG)
"You assist an unjust administration most effectively by obeying its orders
and decrees. An evil administration never deserves such allegiance.
Allegiance to it means partaking of the evil.* *A good person will resist an
evil system with his whole soul. Disobedience of the laws of an evil state
is therefore a duty." (MKG)*

----------

From: Theo Homan theohoman at yahoo.com
Subject: LL-L "Idiomatica" 2009.08.20 (02) [EN]

From: Henry Pijffers henry.pijffers at gmail.com
 Subject: LL-L "Idiomatica" 2009.08.19 (02) [EN-NL]

Jacqueline wrote:
 >
> I think the question is: do you say it?
>
I don't know about the rest (of the Twentenaren), but in my family
nobody ever said "ik hou van jou" or "ik vind je lief". By never I
truly mean never in the strictest sense of the word. Never had a Saxon
speaking loved one either, So the "Ik hold' van u" is my personal
concoction actually.

But I'd still like to know, cause just because others don't use it,
doesn't mean I can't.

Ron wrote:
>
> I would say:
> Written: Ik heff di leef.
> Phonemic: /ʔik hev diy leyv/
> Phonetic: [ʔɪk hɛf di ˈlɛɪf]
>
> Cf. German:
> Ich liebe dich. (I love you [lover])
> Ich habe dich lieb. (I love you [relative, friend, etc.])
>
Yes, I could say "Ik heb u leef", just like we say "ik heb je lief" in
Dutch, but that's along another line. I'm wondering if there's an
equivalent to "Ich liebe dich" in Saxon.

love,
Henry

Hi,

Well, as this discussion about love in the east of the Netherlands is going
on [please, pay a visit to Oldenzaal etc.] I drop my penny.

There was a word in Dutch we used, but it got obsolete: from everyday-use it
moved direction high-romantic and poetic.

This word was regular in older dutch; and in old-saxon, i.e. in the Heliand,
it was 'minnion' =  to love.

My guess is that 'minne' got out of use, because it was one of the 'typical'
terms in the texts that were considered to be mystic writings.

And so after the reformation the catholic  'minne (voor god)' was not done
[and replaced by 'vrees -fear- voor god'].

vr. gr.
Theo Homan

PS: And -of course- for the psychologists among us:  after the reformation I
shouldn't feel 'minne' for myself, so I couldn't feel minne for the others.
Hmmm...

----------

From: Theo Homan theohoman at yahoo.com
Subject: LL-L "Etymology" 2011.08.15 (03) [NL]

From: Roland Desnerck roland.desnerck at telenet.be
Subject: LL-L "History"

Beste laaglanders,

1. "bendig" wordt ook in West-Vlaanderen gebruikt, maar met een totaal
andere betekenis, nl.
 - eergierig, eigenzinnig;
 - gierig, meer dan zuinig.

2. "aandacht" is een Nederlands woord dat in het West-Vlaams niet voorkomt.
Dus in het Nederlands inderdaad een ontlening!?

Toetnoasteki (tot volgende keer).
In Frans-Vlaanderen zegt men, en 't is grappig: à tnoasteki...

Roland Desnerck
Rogierlaan 25
8400 Oostende
België

---------

From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
Subject: Etymology

Beste Roland,

Het Hoogduitse heeft *Andacht *in de zin van 'aandacht', '(spirituele)
eerbied' en '(stille) aanbidding'. Dus is Nederlands "aandacht" misschien
een Hoogduits leenwoord.

Ik ben me niet bewust van het bestaan van een verwante woord in het
Nedersaksisch van Duitsland. Maar het bijvoeglijk naamwoord/bijwoord *
andächtig* wordt wel gebruikt, en ik neem aan dat het een hoge Duitse leenwoord
is.

Groeten,
Reinhard/Ron
Seattle, USA
Hi,

In de Statenbijbel 1637, ondermeer Job 37, staat: ...hoort met aandacht...

Dus het zal wel een van de ongelooflijk vele duitse woorden geweest zijn die
men gewoon heeft overgenomen.
Waar nooit de aandacht op wordt gevestigd is dat men graag leende uit het
duits, omdat het gangbare nederlandse woord niet acceptabel was, omdat zo'n
woord teveel aan de katholieken deed denken. [In dit geval zou zo'n woord
wel iets als 'attentio' geweest kunnen zijn.]
De mensen die zich met de Statenbijbel 1637 hebben bezig gehouden, hebben
zo'n krakkemikkig nederlands product geproduceerd dat zij toch nauwelijks
nederlands-geletterd genoemd kunnen worden. [Dus niet AAA+ niveau, maar meer
C+.]

vr.gr.
Theo Homan

PS: En de nederlandse bijbelbewerking van van Maerlant van 1270 zulen ze er
wel ook nooit bij hebben gehad.
*
----------

*From: Hannelore Hinz <hannehinz at t-online.de> <hannehinz at t-online.de>
Subject: LL-L "Idiomatica" 2009.08.20 (02) [EN]

Leiw' Lowlanners,

so will ick liekers bi all' mien leeg Befinn'n ok mien Nahsinnen vermellen.
Ick müßt bi dit Thema gliek an ein Beläwnis denken.
In ein Theaterstück "Rose Bernd" seggt Rose tau ehren  Leiwsten "... ich bin
dir guat" (Mundart). Achter mi fröggt ein Kierl sien Fru " wat hett sei
seggt", säd sien Fru "ick bün di gaud" un löt sick  sien Bodderbrot gaud
smecken.

Eine großartige Nachwuchsschauspielerin spielte die Rose Bernd.

http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ruth_Maria_Kubitschek

http://de.wikipedia.org/Rose_Bernd

John Brinckman schrieb:

*Wat mag ick di girn*

*Wat mag ick di girn,
du söt oll lütt Dirn!
Wat sünd din Külpen so grell!
As wenn dor' ne Sünn
in beid se stünn
un schen up blage Söll.

So schier büst, so glatt,
so quick as 'ne Katt,
man dat du nich kratzt un nich stellst;
din Münd is so rasch
un din Wurt knasch un  basch,
man dat du nich lüggst un nich schellst.

Un büst du mi got,
denn so kumm up min'n Schot
un wäs' man nich zipp un nich öt!
Un büst du mi bös,
denn gah nah de Gös'
un kik mi doch  an nich so söt!

...un so  wüür ick dat ok seggen.

*(Mihr schaff' ick hüt nich ...)

Best' Gräuten.

Hanne
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