Rotation Symbols

Valerie Sutton signwriting at MAC.COM
Fri Jul 6 02:44:08 UTC 2007

Hi Kelly Jo -
Thanks for your opinion. It is good to know that people like things  
the way they are. And of course more symbols is not the is  
just more consistent as a whole, with the entire writing system...if  
all the Movement Arrows had 8 rotations. The programming problems we  
have with the Rotation Symbols can be fixed in some kind of special  
programming without adding more symbols, I suppose. But adding the  
basic 8 rotations would take away the need for special programming.  
And I personally use the diagonal Rotation Symbols myself, and I have  
missed it in the software over the years...

But enough on that subject. It is good to know your opinions...thank  
you! It probably won't happen, and even if it does, it will be  
another year to two years at least...

As you know, with SignWriter DOS, we could never have written the  
handshapes from Ethiopia. At least now, with SignPuddle, we can add  
new symbols when we want to, so we are lucky to be able to add new  
handshapes when requested.

And speaking of adding new handshapes...that is another case where we  
existed very well without the Flat Hand on the Diagonal Plane, or the  
In-between Palm Facings, or the different degrees of open and closed  
Angled hands, and many other detailed handshapes we have in the the truth is that it is up to the writer to choose how much  
detail they want to write with, and if they wish to use some detailed  
symbols from the ISWA, which is the equivalent to the IPA, then I  
guess it is for them to choose that...or not to choose that, as the  
case may be...

I think it is great that you are choosing to write simply, Kelly Jo.  
That is the best for everyday use for sure...

By the way, there is no need for me to add bigger arrows either to  
the ISWA. That would create more additional symbols and I will never  
ever be able to get every variation of size needed, so just combining  
existing arrows, like this sign, is a way to do it without having to  
construct a new symbol...and I would assume that it is not jerky but  
the arrows are showing continuous movement from one arrow to the  
next... Val ;-)

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On Jul 5, 2007, at 6:57 PM, K.J. Boal wrote:

> I actually can't think of a sign, just offhand, where I would use  
> the diagonal forearm . . . I have to agree with Stefan here, the  
> symbolset we have (restricted though it is) is enough
> to approximate what we need.  As a linguist, I can say with  
> confidence that you don't want to write what's REALLY happening,  
> but what the native speaker (or for our purposes, signer)
> THINKS is happening.   For me, the forearms in PLAY feel parallel  
> to the floor, so I would use rotation symbol #2 no matter how I was  
> really signing it.  For the same reason,
> there are a number of times I wanted a curved arrow that didn't  
> exist, so I substituted a straight-line movement and felt it worked  
> just fine.
> I think the reason rotation symbols are so difficult, Val, is that  
> we're not used to reading and writing in three dimensions.  We can  
> handle wall-plane and floor-plane motion
> separately, but when you get both of them working together in one  
> symbol, it's harder to wrap our minds around it.  There's not much  
> anyone can do about that, except to make
> sure they're well explained in the instruction manual!
> KJ
> > From: signwriting at MAC.COM
> > Subject: Re: [sw-l] Rotation Symbols
> > Date: Thu, 5 Jul 2007 13:19:23 -0700
> > To: sw-l at
> >
> > SignWriting List
> > July 5th, 2007
> >
> > Just as traveling rotations can travel at diagonals, the static non-
> > traveling rotations could also have the forearm at diagonals...the
> > symbols would be consistent with each other, and we would have added
> > choices for signs like PLAY in ASL...
> >
> > See attached...What do you all think?
> >
> >
> >
> >
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