Movement to the side

Fri Nov 28 04:27:16 UTC 2008

I feel the same way, Stefan - I always write single stemmed arrows for side-to-side movement.  But it is interesting what Andre had to say... I didn't think about connecting the single-stemmed arrows with floor plane handshapes and double-stemmed arrows with wall plane handshapes.  It makes sense to me, though!  And if the kids feel it is easier to read when the arrow stems match the handshape plane, then maybe we should think about adopting that as a convention... 

KJ
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Stefan Wöhrmann 
  To: 'SignWriting List' 
  Sent: Thursday, November 27, 2008 10:42 AM
  Subject: AW: [sw-l] Movement to the side

  Hi Andrè, 

  I agree with Adams comment - it doesn't matter. - smile - From my point of view - I prefer single stemmed arrows if the movement is directly to the left or right side. But this attitude developed over time - I guess it is a matter of clear structure .. . 

  Sometimes I hesitate if I should vote for top - down or frontview  if a  handorientation allows  both options ... and in the past we discussed this point that almost always both hands in a sign should be written - (if possible) from the same point of view ( both hands top down, or both hands front view) But even here I decide to violate this "principle" if anything seems to prevent the reader to understand intuitively and alost without any hesitation. 

  So - my opinion - left and right movement - (if they are meant to be straight to the left and straight to the right)   c a n   be written with both arrows ( double stemmed and sinle stemmed) but in these cases I always vote for the single stemmed arrows.

  Stefan ;-) 

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  Von: sw-l-bounces at majordomo.valenciacc.edu [mailto:sw-l-bounces at majordomo.valenciacc.edu] Im Auftrag von Gagnon et Thibeault
  Gesendet: Donnerstag, 27. November 2008 18:04
  An: SignWriting List
  Betreff: Re: [sw-l] Movement to the side

  Hi Adam and everyone,

      Yes, (A) and (B) are correct or the same.  But Deaf students'thinking is different from your thinking.  For example, Deaf students develop a phonological analysis for different SW symbols (hand on the floor or wall plane and single-stemmed arrow (floor plane) and double-stemmed arrow (wall plane)).  Deaf students found that they are more comfortable to read (B) than (A) because of the same wall planes.  It is very important for me to understand how to acquire and learn a phonological analysis for Deaf kids, not Deaf adults.  For example, a Deaf kid who is 7 years old is able to read (B) more easy than (A) according to Deaf teacher.

      I don't doubt that older kids are able to read either (A) and (B) than younger kids.

      Regards,

      André

    ----- Original Message ----- 

    From: Adam Frost 

    To: SignWriting List 

    Sent: Thursday, November 27, 2008 11:03 AM

    Subject: Re: [sw-l] Movement to the side

    The difference between using the single stem arrow and double stem for side movements is just writers preference. Either is still correct. So (A) and (B) are the same. (C) and (D) have the hands on the floor plane which is different from (A) and (B). I am not surprise that the deaf students are talking about floor and wall planes. ;-)

    Adam

    On Nov 27, 2008, at 7:15 AM, "Gagnon et Thibeault" <atg at videotron.ca> wrote:

      Hi Val, Adam, Stefan and everyone,

          It is interesting that Deaf students talked about a front view and a top view.

          See my attached diagram.  This is my writing (A) (DEFENDRE (French) = INTERDICT (English).  Deaf students are confused to read it because they stopped reading and figured out it.  Several Deaf students explained that the two hands are parallel with the front wall (front view), and the movement to the side with the single-stemmed arrows is viewed from the floor (top view).   They suggested that the two hands are parallel with the front wall (front view), and the movement to the side with the double-stemmed arrows is viewed from the front wall (front view) (See the attached diagram (B) because Deaf students read it easily (the same front view).  They told Deaf teacher if they use the two hands which are parallel with the floor, they use the movement to the side with the single-stemmed arrows whhich is viewed from the floor (top view) (See the attached diagram (C).  They don't want to use (D) since they aren't conformtable to read it.

          I can't believe that Deaf students understand a concept of the front view and the top view.

          I adopt Deaf students'proposal.

          Regards,

          André

      <SW DEFENDRE.doc>

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