[An-lang] etymology of Malayic "kasi" ('give')

[David Gil]

I would say that final /h/'s (< /*-q/) in Malay are just as much a mess 
as final glottal stops, varying substantially and often unpredictably 
from dialect to dialect, and certainly not limited to grammaticalized 
forms like causative /kasi/.  In some dialects, the presence or absence 
of final /h/ or glottal stop is conditioned by the intonational or 
syntactic environment, with word-final /h/ or glottal stop favoured in 
phrase-final environments but disfavoured in phrase-medial 
environments.  Daniel mentioned Kupang Malay: there the situation is 
even more complex, as forms such as /kasi/ may occur in phrase-medial 
position not just as /kas/ but also as /kays/, undergoing metathesis, 
presumably under substrate influence from Uab Meto.

To get back to the 'give' < 'love' etymology: I would thus consider the 
putative distinction between forms /kasi/ and /kasih/ to be largely an 
artefact of orthographic conventions.  For me, the problems with the 
etymology were semantic: I say "were", because I think that Uri and 
Daniel have provided convincing "bridging" contexts from languages in 
Kalimantan and Sulawesi.

David


On 18/02/2015 03:56, Robert Blust wrote:
> David,
>
> I'm not talking about "final glottal stops".  I'm talking about
> *-q, which regularly became Malay /-h/.  You'll notice that it appears 
> in /kasih/, where we would expect it (from *ka-qasiq --- see the ACD), 
> but not in /kasi/, which is why I told you when you first sent your 
> inquiry out that I don't know of a good etymology for the latter.
>
> Best,
>
> Bob
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "David Gil" <gil at eva.mpg.de>
> To: <an-lang at anu.edu.au>
> Sent: Tuesday, February 17, 2015 1:06 AM
> Subject: Re: [An-lang] etymology of Malayic "kasi" ('give')
>
>
>> Bob,
>>
>> Final glottal stops within the Malayic family is a huge topic that I've
>> been working on intermittently for many years.  But it's such a mess
>> that I would not dare to use it as a diagnostic for etymologies.
>>
>> David
>>
>>
>> On 17/02/2015 07:00, Robert Blust wrote:
>>> Hi again David,
>>>
>>> So you must be assuming that /kasi/ was borrowed back into Malay from a
>>> language that regularly lost *-q.  If so, what is the likely source?
>>>
>>> For the etymology of Malay /kasih/ see PMP *qasiq and its subentry 
>>> *ka-qasiq
>>> in the freely accessible ACD (www.trussel2.com/ACD).
>>>
>>> Best,
>>>
>>> Bob Blust
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "David Gil" <gil at eva.mpg.de>
>>> To: "Austronesian languages" <an-lang at anu.edu.au>
>>> Sent: Sunday, February 15, 2015 8:24 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [An-lang] etymology of Malayic "kasi" ('give')
>>>
>>>
>>>> Dear all,
>>>>
>>>> Many thanks for all of your suggestions, either to me personally or to
>>>> the list.  In fact, there was unanimity that the source of Malayic
>>>> "kasi" ('give') is in a similar word for 'love' or 'compassion'.  At
>>>> first I was not too convinced; it felt a little bit too much like a 
>>>> folk
>>>> etymology.  However, some of the later comments, with data from a 
>>>> wider
>>>> range of languages such as Onya Darat (Land Dayak, thanks to Uri 
>>>> Tadmor)
>>>> and Tae' (Torajan, thanks to Daniel Kaufman), provided evidence that
>>>> this is most probably the correct etymology.
>>>>
>>>> Again, thanks to you all for your comments,
>>>>
>>>> David
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 07/02/2015 16:13, David Gil wrote:
>>>>> Dear Austronesianists,
>>>>>
>>>>> I am trying to find an etymology for Malayic "kasi" ('give').  Can
>>>>> anybody ...
>>>>>
>>>>> (1) point me to a previously proposed etymology for "kasi"?
>>>>> (2) suggest possible cognate forms in other (non-Malayic) 
>>>>> Austronesian
>>>>> languages?
>>>>> (3) offer any other relevant thoughts and suggestions?
>>>>>
>>>>> So far I have not been able to find anything.  My current thinking is
>>>>> that "kasi" may be part of a complex of interrelated forms such as
>>>>> Standard Malay "ke" ('to'), "akan" (future, oblique), and "=kan"
>>>>> (causative, applicative), but this remains speculative.
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>
>>>>> David
>>>>>
>>>> -- 
>>>> David Gil
>>>>
>>>> Department of Linguistics
>>>> Max Planck Institute for Evolutionary Anthropology
>>>> Deutscher Platz 6, D-04103 Leipzig, Germany
>>>>
>>>> Telephone: 49-341-3550321 Fax: 49-341-3550333
>>>> Email: gil at eva.mpg.de
>>>> Webpage:  http://www.eva.mpg.de/~gil/
>>>>
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>>>
>>>
>>
>> -- 
>> David Gil
>>
>> Department of Linguistics
>> Max Planck Institute for Evolutionary Anthropology
>> Deutscher Platz 6, D-04103 Leipzig, Germany
>>
>> Telephone: 49-341-3550321 Fax: 49-341-3550333
>> Email: gil at eva.mpg.de
>> Webpage:  http://www.eva.mpg.de/~gil/
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> An-lang mailing list
>> An-lang at anu.edu.au
>> http://mailman.anu.edu.au/mailman/listinfo/an-lang
>>
>
>
>
>

-- 
David Gil

Department of Linguistics
Max Planck Institute for Evolutionary Anthropology
Deutscher Platz 6, D-04103 Leipzig, Germany

Telephone: 49-341-3550321 Fax: 49-341-3550333
Email: gil at eva.mpg.de
Webpage:  http://www.eva.mpg.de/~gil/

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