Grand Ronde spellings and others for CJ

[Jeffrey Kopp]

Hi, all!  I'd like to welcome Robin Henderson to the group.  I also see
many others I've met have made it onto the list, and several I haven't
had a chance to meet yet, on the reservation and all over the country!
I have received over 400 messages from the Chinook list.  Great work,
Dave!

On reviewing my list I see I have hastily skimmed many messages and need
to go back and reread them.  Once I peek in a message, my mail reader
marks it as "already read" and I tend to forget it.  I need to remember
to mark messages I can't finish at the moment as "unread" so they'll
stay highlighted in my folder.

Well, I found Tony's spelling (with all the X's and !'s) quite
incomprehensible at first when I saw it in email, but after the workshop
I found I could read it easily.  Perhaps just seeing him put in on the
blackboard while he explained and pronounced it made the difference.
The notes and recording of the workshop have been a bit delayed (we've
all been busy) but I hope to be able to circulate them within about six
weeks.  Perhaps the confusion of some by the spelling variation will be
relieved somewhat then.

I don't have an opinion on spelling myself (I'm trying to model my
involvement with the Jargon after C-SPAN's involvement with Washington),
although when Marv considered using the Kamloops Wawa script in his
Kumtux Tutor software I urged him to stick with Roman characters to
avoid making the language too intimidating to beginners.  After
extensive work with it (including developing a computer font), he
eventually set the shorthand aside as it also was technically difficult
to implement the hand script on a computer screen.  

But it does seem that while the varied spelling methods and phonetic
Roman scripting of Tony's makes it harder on the beginners whose
knowledge of the Jargon is mostly based on Gibbs/Shaw (most of us,
including myself), once you do get the hang of it, seeing the alternate
spellings does improve one's sense of the pronunciation, helping to
"hear" the Jargon in the mind when seeing it written.  All the spelling
methods only approximate the Jargon, and the diversity of spelling,
while making the Jargon more complicated, does help fill in the gaps
when trying to mentally connect the language written down with how it
sounds.

So hang in there, keep grappling with it, and look forward to the
character chart and recording coming to you when I receive all the
pieces and get the workshop package assembled and distributed.

Regards,

Jeff

On Wed, 6 Jan 1999 16:45:27 -0800, you wrote:

>Let's not forget, while discussing spelling, that Jargon varies widely in
>pronunciation from place to place. I doubt Alaska speakers could
>understand a word Siskiyou speakers pronounced. Therefore, before we can
>develop a scientific writing system, we have to decide whose Jargon is
>the 'real' one. (Or, stated another way, who will be in the vast majority
>of "incorrect" speakers.)
>
>As those involved with Native languages will tell you, the issue of how
>to write an unwritten language is not trivial. I know Navajo linguists
>who rue the day their language was alphabetised. I myself find much of
>the Jargon in this group incomprehensible. Part of this is because many
>members have chosen transcriptions that vary widely from those I'm used
>to. But a lot of it is because I can't even figure out what they're
>saying when I read their messages out loud to myself. Their Jargon is too
>"weird."
>
>At base, the problem is that Jargon was never intended to be written, and
>doing so changes it in some dramatic ways. In real life, we're supposed
>to have eye contact with each other, to subtitle our words simultaneously
>in Native sign, and to use exaggerated vocal and facial expressions to
>convey degree.
>
>All of which is to say, let's be careful of being good little 21st
>century eggheads and get all wrapped up in spelling, pronunciation, and
>grammar. (Not that there's anything wrong with light discussion of these
>topics.) For Jargon scholars, this is a little like boring a hole in the
>bottom of a swamped boat to let the water out.
>
>Mahsie naika kumtukh (Mahsie nika kumtux, massie niga komtuch, etc.)
>
>
>
>Robin Henderson
>Writer and Photographer
>
>Check out my biweekly column on world languages:
>http://www.suite101.com/welcome.cfm/world_languages