LL-L "History" 2008.01.16 (08) [E]

[Lowlands-L List]

L O W L A N D S - L  -  16 January 2008 - Volume 08
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From: Joachim Kreimer-de Fries <Kreimer at jpberlin.de>
Subject: LL-L "Language varieties" 2008.01.16 [E]

15.01.2008 R. F. Hahn wrote:

> The state of Saxony and its German dialects have nothing to do with
> all this. The name "Saxony" was "stolen" by them, and it took the
> real Saxons a couple of centuries to get over it (and some
> obviously still haven't ... ;-) ). This name usurpation in
> conjunction with poor education has led to much confusion in
> Germany and stands in the way of ordinary people adopting "Saxon"
> with regard to the true Saxon-derived language.

Very true and outrageous, best Reinhard & all,

In 1423, Frederick the Militant became Margrave of Meissen and was
assigned - by emperor Sigismund - the Duchy of Saxony-Wittenberg,

which had already been an illegitimate inheritor of the name Saxony.

With it the Margraviate of Meissen entered into the electorate of
Saxony (became the title and the rights of one of the Prince-Electors
[Kurfürsten] of the Holy Roman Empire,

which had time ago belonged to the Electoral-Duchy of the

(already by the franconian Emperor Charlemagne subdued)

Saxon, which had been smashed by Emperor Frederick II Barbarossa in
vengeance because the disobedience of the Duke of Saxony Henrik the
Lion, to join Barbarossa's military campaign in and against Italy.

-------------------------------------------------------------------
So the historically, ethnically and linguistically correct name of
today's German state Pseudo-Saxony is:

"Mark/March of Meissen", and that of there dialect might be
"Meissenerish German" or "Meissnerian Thuringian"!
--------------------------------------------------------------------

And the like we should call it, without any aversion or prejudice
against it's honest people, speaking a dialect of Middel/South German
origin, which had been once the language of the Thuringian Germanic
tribe, which coloninized this former Slavonic land.

BUT:
The derivates of the Saxon language however we should just call
==> Saxon/Sassisk/Sassisch, Modern Saxon/Sassisk/Sassisch and the like!

(Nevertheless the solution used in this community, "Low Saxon", might
remain a tollerable compromise, albeit half concession to the High
German/Alemannic/Franconian Ideologists...)

Have a look at the visualisation of the peregrination of the name
"Saxony" in this map: http://www.sachsengeschichte.de/sachsenkarte.html

and if you are familiar with German, have the look at that website,
which is dedicated to the question "Why the Saxons are not
Saxons" (in German).

...

Goutgaon!

Joachim Kreimer-de Fries

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From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
Subject: History

Hi, Joachim!

Thanks for the erudite explanation above! It's so nice to have a fellow
harper on the same theme.

I will post the rest of your submission under "Language varieties", where it
belongs, and I will refer to that information for future purposes. Thanks
for that as well.

Kumpelmenten!
Reinhard/Ron
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